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Political reasons. Maybe they don't like the stock because of the revenue multiple. There's a variety of gripes that people have, but I saw Jason Calacanis fire back, say, hey, you can create a synthetic index that you want to own the S&P499. Just go do that. And it seemed a little complicated. How complicated is it?

2 billion for a long time. Right. And so there are more like not in theme but accelerated by. So I don't know, there's also just like, listen, SAS company, there's loads of incredible venture companies, you know, startups under 2 billion. Yeah, like loads of them. Yeah. You know, I talk to them, you know, several times a week minimum in public. Until the Bottleneck Bros. Came along, until AI came along, there was not a lot happening in public. Small cap land. And by the way, on this, all these small caps, these bottlenecks, this AI, it does feel a little weird to me that you could have a large following on social media, post about, buy stock at something and then post about, outline your thesis in a $35 million market cap company and send it up like 1,000%. And there's a lot of that going on. And by the way, this is not like a serenity comment. I think that guy's. That person is smart. But I mean there's a lot of shady stuff happening, it feels like to me. Sure. Well, yeah, and it's always, you look back at, you were a young analyst, Fidelity, right. During the end of the dot com cycle and there was a lot of just like euphoria stuff happening. And in the years that followed, there was consequences, right. There were people ultimately had to face sometimes civil penalties, all sorts of different things. Companies went bankrupt, there were all sorts of different perturbations in the market. And of course we got a bunch of really enduring generational companies through that period too. Although a lot of these accounts are anonymous and I'm sure they're logged into social media with a made up email called through a vpn. And so I don't know, we'll see. It is different than a sell side research report that maybe goes a little bit too far, but there's still a whole compliance department around it. We are in uncharted territory. So everyone needs to stay safe out there and do your own research. I suppose those. Yeah. Anyway. Well guys, man, this was super fun. This was great. Let's do it again soon. Thank you so much. Anytime. Let's get the whole team on too. Yeah, that's actually fun. Yeah, do that with the whole team.

And I think in general it's just like I kind of want to take a step back and like all this trillionaire hate from the left. It's like there's a great post from my friend Kevin Mahaffey saying like, oh, this is a Bond villain who's decarbonizing the world. Last time I checked, people on the left, the environment, connecting poor people in low income countries, schools and hospitals to the Internet, very low cost, and he's helping blind people see today and interact with the world. That's a villain. And then just like there's so many parts of the SpaceX story, like all of the blue collar workers who've got super wealthy. If you're opposed to data centers on Earth because the environment, well, SpaceX is your solution. So there was another great post that just said the left won and they don't even appreciate it. The world's first trillionaire has done more to solve the environment than everyone else on Earth could buy. Yeah, there was another good one. It's like, yeah, Elon could solve world hunger by market selling every piece of stock that he has and send the world into a global economic downturn, losing millions of jobs in the process. Yeah, somebody said, Elon, that the World bank could solve hunger with 5 billion. He said, if you prove it to me, I'll do it. And turns out you can't solve world hunger for $5 billion. But yeah, SpaceX is certainly, I would say SpaceX, Nvidia, Tesla, they've all been very special to be in kind of a different way. But man, there is nothing like a rocket lodge.

Sovereignty ends up, and I think, you know, there'll still be a big build out for that, but man, sovereign AI at the frontier? I don't see it. Yeah. What do you think the drivers are of the widening gap between Chinese open source models and American closed source models is China's made a terrible mistake not, you know, taking it feels like the administration has been willing to let them buy H200 P30s. Oh, yeah. And I think they're on this, like, they have this crazy belief that, oh, our own internal chips are good enough. They're not. And then I think what's making them think that is that Chinese labs are very, very good at distillation. Somebody told me it only took 160,000 reasoning traces from 01 and 03 to get the original deep seq. They're very clever at industrial scale distillation, running it through multiple APIs, pinging each API from. You know, we've all seen those iPhone farms in China. You know, they've got, they've got the same thing for distillation, and they've got, you know, 100,000 endpoints distilling these models across every API available. They've gotten really, really good at that. But, man, all that goes away if people stop releasing these models at the frontier. And I think Mythos is a side of things to come there. Yeah, yeah. It seems like they're getting much better at locking down the reasoning traces, locking down the espionage. It feels like back during the one days, the labs weren't even aware that distillation was so possible, that that was something that was such a potential threat for sure. Jordan, please. Is any part of your.

Value kind of on the other side of these bottlenecks. Whenever, whenever that is as far as land. Is land a bottleneck? Man, I do think the math for orbital compute, to me, once they can reuse starship, yeah, I think the math for orbital compute becomes pretty compelling. It's just 60 billion to bring on a gig. Terrestrial 25 is power and cooling. You don't need that in space. And so the right comp for that 35 billion of kind of, you know, IT equipment, GPU, CPU switches, you know, memory storage is is that 25 billion versus the cost of launch. And once starship is reusable, I think the cost of launch is 5 billion. So 20 that means you can put a gig into space for 30 billion and the gig on Earth is 60 billion. And that 25, the power and cooling feels reasonably inflationary to me. So I don't know that I would say land is in the token path. Maybe beachfront property, but that's about it. Beachfront property is beachfront property. Airplanes, really nice cars, firmly in the token path. All that stuff is in the token path. I gotcha. How do you think the events of last last week with Anthropic and DC update different countries on their own?

That makes a particular material that goes into semiconductor supply chain people are hunting for like the final, the final ingredient. Maybe it's just sand that turns into silicon. Yeah. I do think the Bottleneck Bros. As they are called are this like bottleneck trade is kind of nearing its end. Okay. And you know I did, you know the Wall Street Journal had the story about this Japanese company that makes. I forget what they make. And you know, everybody's in this because they thought they were going to raise prices and then they just said we're actually not going to raise prices. This is the wrong thing for us. And I almost posted yesterday on X welcome to Japan to all of the Bottleneck people. But you know, everybody's, you know, having clawed run. What's the next bottleneck? Yeah, that was, that was the game for the last year. The next game is what has enduring franchise value kind of on the other side of these bottlenecks. Whenever, whenever that is as far as land is land a bottleneck, man. I do think the math for Orbital Compute to me once they can reuse starship, I think the math for Orbital Compute becomes.

Display all summer long in Washington. Anyway. UFC anthropic. What else is going on? Meta is doing a 180 according to Amir over at the Information, trying to be the vanguard of token minimizing. I think the token maxing, token minimizing thing is so silly because do you know where maxing comes from really? Like it comes from gamer lingo usually. And adopted by looksmaxing community. I don't know if looks maxing community was the first one. They certainly made it really, really popularized. Like I feel like through. Yeah. Effectively through clavs clipping. Yeah. That language, the idea of like doing anything like, oh, I'm, I'm computer maxing today. Yeah. Isn't it from like min maxing. Min maxing. And that's what I'm getting at. Like, you shouldn't be token maxing or token minning. You should be token min maxing. And the idea of min maxing is when you're in a video game, you want to get the most resources for the lowest cost. So if you're playing League of Legends, you're going to put just the right amount of gold into this particular item or this particular stat point in an RPG and you're going to try and find the optimal build based on your resources. You have confined resources. And somehow it feels like tech and all these companies went through some sort of hallucinatory period where they lost sight of that. They should always have been min maxing because that is the goal of business at all times in all things. Like, you know, you would never say like, oh yeah, we're ad maxing this quarter. We're going to buy as many ads as possible. Oh no, it didn't work. We spent way too much on ads. They were not effective. We need to admin spend as little as possible on marketing. It's like you always want to be spending. You always want to be getting the most return on ad spend. The highest leverage output there was. And again, unsubstantiated post. Yes. But somebody was saying they talked to somebody at Meta and there was one engineer that spent $90,000 in one day and was quickly terminated, really terminated within three days. So again, could just be entirely fake news. But yeah, it seems somewhat informed. The crazy thing is that, is that like the lesson from that this guy's like, I'm not getting fired. I'm going to use AI more than anyone else in the whole company. I'm riding loops. $90,000 bill the. I mean, so. So the lesson that will be learned from that is, is don't spend $90,000 a day. But like the super bowl is literally for a marketer, the super bowl is spend 5 million in one day. And it works sometimes. And sometimes super bowl ads deliver $20 million. But what do teams do when they run super bowl ads? Right. We ran our super bowl ad. We trained our own model in order to no but no. We made sure that ours was ROI positive and we only bought the ad in a small market and we did it before the game. We renew our audience was and so for a very low cost, we were able to get a very high value. So I believe we got a very high return on investment. We min maxed the Super Bowl. Now there were some companies that sort of just super bowl maxed and they just spent a ton of money. And when you looked at the data on how they were received by audiences, it seemed like, oh, they definitely didn't get $5 million in brand value back. In fact, maybe that ad was poorly received. Some of the AI generated ads I got to give it up to the.

Interesting cross. No. More. More. Seriously, I, as a UFC fan and as an American, I'm excited for the. For the UFC to do well. I'm excited for the fighters to have a platform. I was a little bit wary of this event overall just because the aesthetics of putting on this crazy party. High stakes in this moment when there is a ton to black pill about. Yeah, not after interest rates, all this other stuff going on and. Yeah, so war raging, gas prices are high, house prices are high, rates are going up, having a party. A lot of people in America are not having a good time and it really felt like a bread and circuses moment. Sure, but the bread and circuses, John, it worked on me. Top notch. It worked on me. Some of the best ever. It was, it was. Why was it so good compared to a normal UFC event? Well, you didn't watch, so I guess it's. I guess it's hard. Was it the aesthetics or the actual. Well, so one, the production value. One, the card was absolutely stacked. It was eight fights, no filler, wall to wall. Really? Really. Fights that had a lot of. They carried a lot of weight. Right. So like the. The main title fight, Gaethje vs. Ilya Topuria. That changed both fighters careers like full stop. Right. And even with Bo Nickel joining in just a few minutes, you know Bo, that was the biggest possible stage that any athlete could be on and especially in the ufc, at least here in America. So anyways, going into it, I thought the aesthetics were bad. I was excited to watch the fights. Turned out it was just really cool. And sure, there's still gonna be people that are upset that the President and the admin is platforming something like this. Turned out to be really fun. It was a cool night and I think America kind of needed it. Yeah. A lot of people are saying unprecedented because Teddy Roosevelt held a boxing match in the White House almost 100 years ago around that time. And apparently he fought in the boxing match, which is crazy. Yeah, he was a big boxer. He was big boxer and so imagine, imagine. So this is like a light crazy president. Anyway. But anyways, yeah, I, you know, the event was. Was incredible. And I came away thinking that big parties and sporting events are potentially the most underutilized political strategy. Right. I would actually expect the admins like overall popularity to go up, approval rating to go up based on. Interesting. Based just on this event because there were so many iconic images. Funny enough, the most iconic.

Okay, what do we got? One of the best ads I've ever seen. Okay, we're going from ad in my life. This ad is truly one of the best. Let's pull it up. Wait, what is this? It's just. This is an ad from Cheaper, Usually Cheaper Usually. This is one of those fake. This is one of those fake tech ads that the guy put up in the subway. That's what's going on. No, Cheaper usually. I start thinking, well, in what settings is it not cheaper? It's really tough if you're trying to get people to switch. It's certainly not cheaper if you're trying to go, like, one block. Like a car is always going to be. Is always going to be more expensive. But this also feels like it's like we're trying to be cheaper. It feels like price war with Uber still, but. But it's like we're sort of doing a price war, but not all the time. So you don't know. It's not really a guarantee of. I feel like most marketing campaigns need to guarantee something. Even if it's a moderate guarantee. It's like 5% cheaper every time. Yeah, but. Because if it's cheaper usually, could they not just say cheaper drop the usually? The usually is hilarious. Like, I'm thinking about different campaigns. Like, if you take. If you take a bunch of Lyft rides the same route every single day and you take a bunch of, like, Uber rides. Yeah. Yeah. You could probably just make the argument that it's cheaper. Yeah. Well, what's the. What's that airline that has tagline Bags fly free, but you have to put cheaper and then your logo. Yeah, that's not good either. I think it's Southwest that has bags fly free. Like, can you imagine how bad that campaign would be if it was Bags fly free usually usually like, built Ford's usually. It's usually built for Duff. Not always, but usually. What are some other big. Just do it Usually usually not the most expensive option. Most I. Most. That's even worse because then they're thinking, okay, sometimes it's the most expensive. Anyways, folks, I'm rooting for Lyft. There's some other billboards. The new ChatGPT billboards are really good. Lyft is up 10% in the last month. ChatGPT. The images working. It's really cool. I like it because it has the same, like, it. It is aesthetically pretty, but it's also functional. It, like, don't fly free anymore, apparently. Oh, yeah, they don't. But there was one airline Think different. Usually I'm loving it usually McDonald's a diamond is forever Usually De Beers. What's the other one? Finger licking good Usually KFC it's very ominous the best a man can get Usually Gillette Usually Breakfast of champions Usually have it your way Usually I'm loving Usually Like a good neighbor Like a good neighbor State Farm is there Usually the few, the proud the Marines Usually Taste the rainbow Usually Red Bull gives you wings Usually that's actually probably accurate Anyway, why the friendly skies? Usually Wait, I got to tell you about Shopify.

And the market doesn't like it. Take him has a take here. We can read through his opinion. He says, I don't understand how this Roku deal makes any sense. Bringing together the most valuable live. I'll tell you how it makes sense. How does it make sense? No. So I think it makes sense. One Fox, they have a great product in Tubi, right? It's again there are certain people that are happy with their HBO or Netflix or whatever. But to be has has a great niche. It's been a great acquisition for fox. North of $1 billion of revenue. That is a product. Roku is a platform. They have over 20% market share in connected TVs. I was looking at the data. They have over 40% of the engagement with connected TVs. So when you think about it from an advertising potential, right, it's not just that they have 20% of the connected TV market. They have over 40% of like the watch time effectively, right? So looking at the potential from an advertising standpoint and how many dollars are still yet to shift from traditional television to connected tv. So from that lens I think it's, I think it's great. Roku is also a much younger demo. So like a lot of media, a lot of media properties, right, especially television related are going to be, you know, older demos that are, that are eventually going to be aging out at least of like prime consumers. But these are consumers that are in their prime earning years, prime years as consumers. And so ultimately I think it makes sense. I think it makes sense for Fox next. The thing that I hope that they can do as a consumer is rebundle, right? We've gone through this era of unbundling and the fact that you get a new TV and you're like okay, great, let me log into 15, 10 different services, something like that. I would like to see them do something in bundling for a consumer. So again, looking at it from the lens of having north of 40% of watch time that is a super valuable property. And with the right ad driven approach, I think it'll pay off. I wonder if.

Leave us five stars an hour. No, no, no. We got stuff. Okay, what do we got? One of the best ads I've ever seen. Okay, we're going from ad in my life. This ad is truly one of the best. Let's pull it up. Wait, what is this? This just is an ad from Cheaper, Usually Cheaper. Usually. This is one of those fake. This is one of those fake tech ads that the guy put up in the subway. That's what's going on. Cheaper usually. I start thinking, well, in what settings is it not cheaper? It's really tough if you're trying to get people to switch. It's certainly not cheaper if you're trying to go, like, one block. Like, a car is always going to be. Is always going to be more expensive. But this also feels like it's like we're trying to be cheaper. It feels like price war with Uber still, but it's like we're sort of doing a price war, but not all the time. So you don't know. It's not really a guarantee of. I feel like most marketing campaigns need to guarantee something. Even if it's a moderate guarantee. It's like 5% cheaper every time. Yeah, but. Because if it's cheaper usually, could they not just say cheaper? Even drop the usually? The usually is hilarious. Like, I'm thinking about if you take. If you take a bunch of Lyft rides the same route every single day, and you take a bunch of, like, Uber rides. Yeah. Yeah. You could probably just make the argument that it's cheaper. Yeah. Well, what's the. What's that airline that has tagline Bag fly Free, but you have to put cheaper and then your logo. Yeah, that's not good either. I think it's Southwest that has Bags Fly Free. Like, can you imagine how bad that campaign would be if it was Bags Fly Free Usually usually like, built Ford's Hut Usually. It's usually built for Duff. Not always, but usually. What are some other big. Just do it usually Usually not the most expensive option. Most I. Most. That's even worse because then they're thinking, okay, sometimes it's the most expensive. Anyways, folks, I'm rooting for Lyft. There's some other billboards. The new ChatGPT billboards are really good. Lyft is up 10% in the last month. The ChatGPT, the images working. It's really cool. I like it because it has the same, like, it is aesthetically pretty, but it's also functional. It likes to apply free anymore, apparently. Oh, yeah, they don't. But there was one airline. Think different. Usually I'm loving it. Usually McDonald's. A diamond is forever. Usually De Beers. What's the other one? Finger licking good. Usually kfc. It's very ominous. The best a man can get. Usually. Breakfast of champions. Usually. Have it your way. Usually I'm loving. Usually. Like a good neighbor. Like a good neighbor. State Farm is there. Usually the few, the proud. The Marines Usually. Taste the rainbow. Usually Red Bull gives you wings. Usually that's actually probably accurate.

Doing great, guys. Thanks for having me on. Thank you so much for taking the time. Long overdue. So backstory here is Bo somehow was, like, one of the first 10,000 people to discover TVPN. You're an entrepreneur outside of the octagon, and somehow you were in between camps, or maybe during camps, you maybe saw a funny clip of a couple guys in suits. And, yeah, I remember getting the notification, like, bo Nickel has followed you. And I was like, oh, who's this? Who's subtrol like, account? It was you. And it was a funny moment because, yeah, you know, I probably hadn't even shared that I was a UFC fan on the show, so, first off, congratulations. I was. A lot of. A lot of the fights last night were high stakes, and. But. But yours was the highest stakes because I was watching, and I. I can't imagine what you were going through in the lead up to the fight. Um, but you. You had a perfect performance, and. And it was really fun to watch. Um, wanted to, first off, ask what it was like leading up to this event. Highest profile UFC event ever by far. And. And I want to know. I want to know what that was like. Yeah, it was pretty interesting. Um, I think my experience was a little bit different than a lot of the fighters because I knew immediately after my last fight seven months ago, that I was going to be on the card. You know, I think most guys didn't find out till, you know, probably 10, 12 weeks out. And, you know, I knew seven months that I was going to be on it, so I started prepping immediately. And, yeah, it was just a lot of. A lot more media, a lot more attention, a lot more buzz. Tried to take advantage of that as best I could, you know, first and foremost by being prepared to whoop ass, but secondly, just, you know, the opportunity with the, you know, viewership and stuff like that and maximizing that. But is that. Is. Is that knowing nine months out that you're going to be fighting, like, you know, five feet from the president on the White House lawn? Advantage. Is that an advantage or a disadvantage? Because in some ways, you're probably more locked in. You know, you're taking every moment more seriously. But on the other side, like, I know there's been moments where I know I'm going to be, like, doing public speaking, right? I don't really love public speaking, and usually I'm thinking, like, it'd be nice to just get this over with, but nine months out, you know, that's a lot of time being like, I want to get in there. Yeah, it definitely goes in waves. Like, you know, there's certain times where you feel a little more stressed than certain times you feel really relaxed. For me, it was just staying focused on the process, focused on my systems, refining everything that I do and improving every day. And I knew if I kept doing that for that period of time, that I'd just be as prepared as possible. So, you know, it really, like I said, riding those waves was. Was big, and just being able to, you know, kind of stay. Stay focused on the process and my systems and refine those rather than, like, thinking about this big moment. 24 7. Was the crowd any different? Was the vibe in the stadium any different? Does that affect you during a fight? It was way different to me. I come from a college wrestling background, so, you know, when you're competing in a home match, you got 10, 20,000 people that love you, want you to win, Right? And since transitioning to mma, I've had, like, a little bit of mixed emotions towards me. Some people love me, some people hate me, which is. It's good for me at the end of the day. But this one definitely felt more like my college days, where it was a home match. I felt like everybody was on my side. President Trump was actually. The way he was kind of positioned around the ring, it was like he was right next to my cornerman, so he was almost in my corner. And, yeah, it was.

How you. I don't know. How you go bigger? I don't know. I don't either. In space, on the moon. Top of the Eiffel Tower. Yeah. Top of the. Yeah, maybe. Who knows? Who knows? They're going to figure out something. They always do. There's always something that comes along. But, yeah, I mean, I. I was told this actually did more viewership than the super bowl, which, yeah, doesn't surprise me, but, yeah, it was. It was unbelievable. I mean, they're gonna figure something out, and I'm just gonna keep getting better at fighting, so I focus on that and take care of business on my end. Where were you? Where were you watching Ilia Gaethje from? So what they did was they had us go back to the hotel, do media, and then they had a little room set up for us where we could have all of our families and stuff, because post fight had the presser with all the winners, and we had to wait until main event was over to do the presser. So they kind of set up a nice little area with food and stuff for us, but it was all the fighters in there together, and it was. It was a pretty cool environment. It was insane. Yeah. What was. John. John. Given that he didn't watch, even though he was cheering for you and calling me out here. No, you're. It's okay that you're. It's okay that you're locked in. You're probably reading for Tucker. No, but I was explaining, like, to me, to me, that was. That was the most. You know, the Gaethje Ilya was the most insane UFC moment. You know, going in Underdog, he's lost to a bunch of guys that. That. He's lost to multiple guys that. That Topuria has, you know, wiped the floor with. And for Gaethje to do that in that moment just felt like, what a way. I mean, I was. I was just really happy for the guy. One of those guys who's been on top. And as an American UFC fan, I bet. I bet that fight created, like, a bunch of gaiches and a bunch of. And a bunch of Bo Nickels. I love it. I love it. What does the next week, month, rest of the year look like for you now? Like, what is it? Like, I texted Bell last night, like, so happy for you. You know, blah, blah, blah. You texted back in, like, 30 seconds. I was like, what are you doing right now? I would have just thrown my phone. Yeah, the grinder. I do, like, yeah, post fight for me, I probably take, like, a week or 10 days to do a little media tour. Just kind of maximize that and, you know, do as much as I can and it's kind of just like, you know, business. But I got a couple of things planned for the summer. Of course, a bunch of training. Going to take a two week trip to Japan. See Japan, which is going to be dope. But yeah, usually post fight, like I said, try to, you know, take advantage of the media buzz and then, you know, maybe work a little bit on, on some my businesses, things like that while I'm not, you know, directly preparing for a fight and couple, couple weeks for vacay if I can slip that in. But yeah, always staying busy. You're going to Japan, anything we can do to get you to stop over in China and get in the ring with one of those humanoid robots, I want to see you clock it so hard. Yeah, we just explodes into a million companies. We need to create Bow bench and it's like, Ken, how long, how long can you last? Like 10 milliseconds? Yeah, no easy money for me. I might break my hand on that, but I'll destroy it for padded gloves or something. I don't know. Awesome. Well, so happy for you. Enjoy, enjoy the moment and come back on next time whenever you want to talk about some of your businesses. And yeah, we're very proud and yeah, enjoy the moment to have you as a fan. Thank you so much. Let's do it. Thanks guys. Appreciate you.