LIVE CLIPS
EpisodeĀ 2-12-2026
Lot of destruction for people that try and chase that.
I worry very much. We're hearing more and more about young people, especially women in the past, but now also young guys. We're thinking, oh, they've got to take TRT. That's crazy. I've talked about the fact that at 45, I'm 50 now. At 45 years old, I started taking a microdose of cypionate. Microdose, but micro. So I maintain fertility. I've checked that. I take hcg, et cetera. Never in a million years would I suggest anyone else do that in their 20s or 30s unless they have a serious issue with peptides. There's the risk of where you're getting it from. Purity, right? But there's also the risk that if you're augmenting growth hormone in your teens, your 20s, you can really mess up your hypothalamic, pituitary, body axis, all the organs of your body in major ways. You shut down fertility. If you come off these things, you may revert to a state, a depression, et cetera. I just think the whole looks maxing phenomenon is, is really, really dangerous and foolish, especially in people younger than 40. Right. It's just. Well, especially because there's a way to look smacks without hitting your face with a hammer. Sleep diet, exercise gets you 99% of the way there. Also, see, you need to evaluate kind of where you are at the very end of puberty. Puberty is a very protracted thing. I hit puberty when I was 14. I didn't shave till I was 20. I swear my head and face changed shape over time. You got to let your people develop over a long period of time. If you introduce exogenous hormones or you start blunting estrogen, or you start. Because guys will say, oh, they have too much estrogen, or something where they start taking peptides. I mean, you can really throw off the trajectory of your physiology. And then you're the person in your 40s and 50s often who looks much older. This is the thing that people don't realize, that there's always a dynamic tension between the things that give you vitality and the things that extend your life. If you take growth hormone, you'll feel more vital, you'll gain muscle more easily, recover from injury more easily. You'll lose visceral and body fat. Guess what? You'll also age more quickly. The reason bigger dogs die earlier than smaller dogs is they have higher dosing of growth hormone and IGF1. It's well established. So you get vitality, but you lose time with testosterone. You have to ask yourself, what are you gaining? What are you losing? If you can go from, you know, having no energy whatsoever to the ability to work and exercise, increase libido, et cetera, well, then you're probably gaining years if you're doing those things. But I'm very concerned about people just, you know, trying to get a, whatever an angle, jawline, you know, abs, et cetera. I mean, it's, it's because of phones, right? People are taking photos of themselves. I mean, I'm old school, so I feel like if you're a guy taking pictures of your abs and posting it online, like you need to invest the money in a, in a, in a psychologist, not in its peptide. But that's just, you know, that's a, that's a generation rational thing, right? I think I'm more impressed by what people can do with their physicality, trying hit it some numbers, some lifts, some running, some hiking, some rucking. But this overemphasis on appearance on social media, I think is going to cause a lot of destruction for people that try and chase.
And get people headed in the right direction and then also put the right controls in place. How do you think business models evolve in a world of, you know, potentially millions of agents? Companies aren't really used to running payroll for millions of people, identity for millions of people. Some people are. But how do you think all of that changes going forward? Well, I have a bunch of super strong thoughts on this. Some of them which are maybe counterintuitive. I think, first of all, I think in five years there's going to be way more software engineers than there are today. And it's a little bit of a trick answer, mainly because I think there's going to be way more software and they'll be more productive, but you'll have more software engineers. I guarantee you. All these companies, meta, Amazon, Google, Anthropic, they'll all have more software engineers and buggers. They do today. And double clicking on that. Do you think it's that we're going to see more computer science degrees become software engineers in the traditional sense? Or that designer that you have, that pm, that business leader, maybe even your CFO all of a sudden is a software engineer or is creating software, I. Think what a software engineer does. But I'm not trying to cop out and say all people are going to be vibe coding and that's my software engineer. I mean, people building and architecting software and knowing internals of how it works, they're not going to be writing as much code clearly. But I'll give you a secret. For the last 30 years, we've had integrated development environments that are helping us write code more efficiently. This is a whole nother level. But yeah, it's not a new thing to get better tools to help us make software. So there's going to be more software engineers, but there's going to be even more than the increase in software engineers. There's going to be way more software, which is super exciting and super, super daunting. Now back now, if you layer on, you know, are people going to build all their own software, buy software for vendors? I think that is unequivocally. They're going to buy more software from vendors, for sure. Yeah. Now the trick people have to. People that are just bearish on enterprise software have to remember that there's been open source equivalents of every major platform forever. It's like you could just pick it off the shelf and run it, maintain it. It's easy, right? Yeah. And I think kind of like there's going to be this kind of goes back with my first thing I said about more software engineers. There's going to be more software so there's going to be more packet software. There's going to be more custom built software like for example there'll be a lot of I think people use companies using these software development tools to build the applications that have to span the multiple silos and the multiple systems. Right now these companies have a very hard time of building something that goes from SAP to content management to Salesforce and an end to end process and maybe there'll be more, more customization and more Vibe coding and more you know people doing Claude coding to build that but the core vendors and all of the core data sources and the core business logic and processes that's going to get bigger and bigger and I'm 100% convinced of that which is dangerous. You should never be 100% convinced of anything. I'm trying to make a point here dramatically. No I love it. Last year.
And so we have to get both right. We have to get the business value and get people headed in the right direction and then also put the right controls in place. How do you think business models evolve in a world of, you know, potentially millions of agents? Companies aren't really used to running payroll for millions of people, identity for millions of people. Some people are. But how do you think all of that changes going forward? Well, I have a bunch of super strong thoughts on this. Some them which are maybe counterintuitive. I think first of all, I think in five years there's going to be way more software engineers than there are today. Whoa. And it's a little bit of a trick answer because mainly because I think there's going to be way more software and they'll be more productive, but you'll have more software engineers. I guarantee you. All these companies, Meta, Amazon, Google, Anthropic, they'll all have more software engineers and buggers than you today. And double clicking on that. Do you think it's that we're going to see more computer science degrees become software engineers in the traditional sense? Or that designer that you have, that pm, that business leader, maybe even your CFO all of a sudden is a software engineer or is creating software? I think what a software engineer does. But I'm not trying to cop out and say all people are going to be vibe coding and that's my software engineer. I mean, people building and architecting software and knowing internals of how it works. They're not going to be writing as much code clearly. But I'll give you a secret. For the last 30 years, we've had integrated development environments that are helping us write code more efficiently. This is a whole nother level, but it's not a new thing to get better tools to help us make software. So there's going to be more software engineers, but there's going to be even more than the increase in software engineers. There's going to be way more software, which is super exciting and super, super daunting. Now back now, if you layer on, are people going to build all their own software, buy software for vendors? I think that is unequivocally, they're going to buy more software from vendors for sure. Now the trick, people that are just bearish on enterprise software have to remember that there's been open source equivalents of every major platform forever. It's like you could just pick it off the shelf and run it, maintain it. It's easy, right? Yeah. And I think kind of like there's going to be. This kind of goes back with my first thing I said about more software engineers. There's going to be more software so there's going to be more package software, there's going to be more custom built software like for example there'll be a lot of I think people use companies using these software development tools to build the applications that have to span the multiple silos and the multiple systems. Right now these companies have a very hard time of building something that goes from SAP to content management to Salesforce and an end to end process and maybe there'll be more customization and more vibe coding and more, you know, people doing cloud coding to build that. But the core vendors and all of the core data sources and the core business logic and processes that's going to get bigger and bigger and I'm 100% convinced of that which is dangerous. You should never be 100% convinced. I'm trying to make a point here. Dramatically last year, last year and continuing into this year was all about coding agents. Do you have basic.
Curious when you find a supplement that is working and it's like measured in my case, how should you cycle it? How do you think about cycling it to make sure that you continue to get the benefit? Yeah, this is one of the questions we're asking in the inference engine is because we've done a whole bunch of these different cycles and it's difficult because it's never truly a non confounded experiment, there's always some confound and so when you're trying to tease out little tiny signal, you, you do need to be robust about the analysis. So we don't know. We have some short term data on that but not strong enough that I think I'd express an opinion. So we're hopeful that the bigger data sets will give us insight. Same kind of question on fasting. I inverted the fasting schedule because we do the show, we'll have a big breakfast at 8am, I'll have a second meal at around 2:30 and then I won't eat until the next day at 8am so typically somebody might start eating at 12, have another meal around dinner and then wait until the next day. So I flipped it. Any learnings from that? Personally the marker I would look for. That probably is and to be clear, part of the reason is I actually there's a functional reason which is that the way that we do the show I need to be powered up, fueled up to then podcast for three hours. But then I also don't like being having a big dinner and going to bed. Yeah, you guys work out in the morning together, is that right? Yeah, yeah. 6:30? Yeah, at 6:30. Huge meal, huge meal at 8 8, 8 to 9. Yeah. Anyway, thank you so much for coming on the show. This is fantastic. Lots more to talk about. Yeah, we can go all night, all day. Let me tell you about MongoDB. Choose abilities at the end of the week. Flexibility and scale with best in class embedding models and re rankers. MongoDB has what you need to build what's next. And without further ado, we have Matthew Zeitlin, the correspondent from Heatmap News in the restream waiting room. Let's give it up for correspondence. I'll tell you about Figma while we wait for him. Figma make isn't your average vibe coding tool. It lives in figma so outputs look good, feel real and stay connected to how teams build create code back prototypes. Apparently Tyler tested the CO2. We're at 790, we're at 810 right now. 810 and rising. He caught us on a lowdown. It's going up. He said one thousand. He said it was good under a thousand. I was cool to see what it was at the end of the show. Okay. Okay. Cause we will add more CO2 as the show goes on. Edge in the chat says Jordy has three days and one he's figured out how to manipulate time. You are manipulating time. Anyway, we have our next guest in the Restream writing room. Let's bring him into the TVP in ultradome. How are you doing? Sorry to keep you waiting. What's happening? I'm doing great, guys. Any opportunity to follow up. Brian Johnson is one I will take. It is a fun story. Yeah, he was your opener. I mean you've clearly been doing a lot of looks maxing what's working for you know. I do have friends actually. John and I.
Most of the people that come on the show will be rocking an apple watch or maybe a whoop or an aura. It's very, very common. At the same time, it's missing visual. It's not like pulling in. It's not like the health decisions that somebody makes every day can't always be picked up here. It'd be great to have be like, okay, what did this person eat? What time did they actually go to bed? All these different things. What do you think the future of health wearables is? Is? Yeah. So that's exactly, again, what we're building with this first three people and more immortals. Like, if you say so. My life over the past five years has generated a few billion data points. A few hundred million are useful. That has created a dimensional representation of a human that is higher fidelity than anything ever produced in history. And so we've taken that model, we're going to replicate it with others. And so we're going to try to basically cast this gigantic net of data capture. We'll bring it all in and say, where's the highest signal inputs? And then we'll scale those things. And so, like, you're saying, like, we may find that lighting at bedtime is an incredibly important factor. And like, you know, right now, people don't really think about that or the lighting environment in the room. And you can't do, like, specific photon counts. Yeah. And so we're going to try to tease out, like, where are the little teeny tiny things that have this gigantic yield? But. But it's all about data collection. It's about the inference engine, and it's about people who are willing to say, yes, I'll follow the protocol because it's inherently better than what I would do myself, whether it's guessing and then we'll have everything. Did you ever think about a program where an actual live human just follows around the person in the program and it's effectively there 24 7, kind of like effectively a nanny for the human. Because it's like, hey, you say you're doing everything right, but, like, right before bed you had a phone just blasting light in your face. It feels like that's kind of what you can get to with wearables over time, and you can probably get there today. But I think a lot of people, even if they do a program, will still be kind of sneaking little things in throughout the day that are working against them. And they even forget they're like, I do everything you say. Like, I finished my final meal today four hours before bed and blah blah. You are hiding bright lights before bedtime. Yeah exactly. I can't sleep. What do you do before bed? I'm in my bed. Scrolling TikTok okay well that could be the source. What's the current thinking on peptides? There's a variety of them Semaglutide all the way down to reta what's the most up to date evidence or benefits cost that you've seen? I mean generally peptides are fantastic they are drugs drug equivalents they have drug like effect sizes and some peptides have done the clinical work like tirzepatide Sures but then there's a whole bunch of other class of peptides that we have no human data on really? Yes so the thing that people are. Taking a lot of right? A lot of yeah so we're going. To get some human data is that. Currently retta Is that the one that's like not. I don't know about retta but or there's like even different ones like.
You're not going to vibe code an olive tree. The land exists, the tree exists. You have to select it, press it. There's probably a lot of people involved that there might be some automated ERP system at some point. But how are you thinking about the impacts of AI on your business, your life? I know that that's a big piece of the don't die philosophy is that we are going to go through a change. But how are you processing the most up to date advances in AI. Yeah, you're exactly right. Is like this olive oil we source from farmers all around the world that go through extensive screening. We test every single, every single molecule that we manufacture. We third party test. So they're all very manual processes. And then on the other side we have AI where you take all the data, you do the inference engine, you try to find new insights that's never been found before. But we're this really weird mixture of like leading edge AI and like duct taped together of all the manual things. Like we'll go into someone's house, you measure from mold and toxins and water toxins and air toxins and you look at materials in the house. So it's still very manual and automated. So it's kind of a cool world where we're insulated to some extent. In terms of software, you just stand it up. You're very vulnerable to speed, where this one you're dealing the physical world constraints, you have to bring together all these different disciplines. And there's also this interesting break in that if you want to measure the change in someone over a year and you want to do a year long study, like even if you have a million Einsteins in a data center, like you have to wait a year to get those results. I'm sure there's more things that you can do digging up historical data, all the data that you have, but there is just this natural break on progress when you have to wait for results and then feed that back in 100% makes sense. You talked about testing, what are you finding in organic products? If something's organic, do you just automatically assume that it's not gonna kill you? I assume it's worse than not organic. No, I'm serious. Junkyard dog theory, I'm vindicated. It's true. Honestly, organic only looks at a certain subset of toxins, it's not all toxins. And then it's a very limited screening protocol. So it's really a marketing tactic. When we test organic, it, it typically performs worse than non organic on many, many variables. So no, I think it's worthless really as a marketing protocol and I would say more broadly I don't trust anyone like literally I don't trust marketing, I don't trust brands, trust no one. I don't trust technicians, I don't trust practitioners. Like when we go out there, honestly, it just, that's why this protocol is. We've built it in such a meticulous fashion. We don't trust any, we don't trust ourselves just trust the data, do our protocol, see what it produces. But when I got in the world I'm just like this is scary. Where do you get things like produce things that aren't, you know you're not going to add apples to the blueprint website, right? If you want to eat an apple, what do you do? So there's no safe place, sadly. Brian Johnson yeah, we no safe place to eat an apple. No apple is safe.
A decade later and has been a fixture in the sport since long before any of his teammates were born. What he had never done was curl under the sport's brightest lights. Rohonen just missed qualifying for the Olympics several times. His most recent heartbreak came before the 2020 Olympic Games when the US trials mixed in doubles. 2022. 2022. Sorry. When the US trials mixed in mixed doubles came down to the last shot, where Honan decided to focus on his law practice and the senior circuit. After, at 50, he finally gave up on his Olympic aspirations. I honestly thought it was over four years ago, he said. Well, I probably thought it was over eight years before that. Then he got an unexpected call. He's back. The captain for one of the nation's up and coming teams was battling a rare autoimmune disease and needed a substitute. On paper, the Gen Xer wasn't the most natural fit. The other curlers were all in their mid-20s, roughly the same age as Ronan's children. He even has a few decades on Team USA's coach. Few decades. But on ice, he blended right in. So when skip Danny Casper recovered from his illness in return, Rohonen stuck around as the alternate team. Casper then qualified for the Olympics and became Team usa. Ronan says throwing the rock at the Olympics would be the single greatest moment of his entire life. Rock. My kids know it and my wife knows it. I'm start using, I'm going to put on curling at home and just start using some of the hardcore terminology. Just be like, ah, I can't. You know, that happened a couple decades ago because on cnbc, which all the hedge funds watch, after the market closed, they would just roll over to NBC coverage when the two companies were together and they would show curling just because of the time change. That's what was on. And so all these Wall street guys became obsessed with curling, got really into it, started placing bets and stuff. It's a fun story. Yeah. I wonder how big is the gambling and sports betting around the Olympics? I don't know. I saw some numbers for the Super Bowl. It was really, really big. But you have to imagine that the Olympics is also huge. While you look that up, let me. Tell you about TurboPuffer. Serverless vector in full text search built. From first principles and object storage. Fast 10x cheaper and extremely scalable. And our next guest is here so we can come back to Olympics coverage after. But let's bring in Brian Johnson to the TVPN ultradome. I will tell you about Vibe co while he walks in where D2C companies, B2B startups and AI companies advertise on streaming, T pick channels, target audiences, and measure sales, just like on Meta. And you might be doing some advertising soon because there's a huge launch. How are you doing? Hey. I brought you guys a gift. Thank you. What'd you bring? Are we doing shots? We're doing shots. Amazing. Here we go. Amazing. Yeah. Have you done a shot of olive oil? I haven't. I've never done a shot of olive oil. What are the benefits? Break it down. Why would I do this? I like olive oil on a steak. Yeah, I mean, have you. Is olive oil a part of your life? Only in the cooking context. Yeah, but I should just be drinking.
Let me tell you about Railway. Railway is the all in one intelligent cloud provider. Use your favorite agent to deploy web apps, servers, databases and more. While Railway takes automatically takes care of scaling modern security. Speaking of Meta, Ray Ban maker Luxottica says it more than tripled Meta AI glasses sales in 2025. Take off. The French Italian eyewear brand said it sold over 7 million AI glasses last year, up from 2 million that the company sold in 2023 and 2024 combined. Wait, so sorry, say that number again. How many did they sell last year? 7 million devices last year. I think I'm starting to see them. I mean, Ashlee Vance came on the show and was wearing them for fun, but also for good content. He's gonna actually include that content in the stuff that he makes. It's a video maker's tool, so it's a prosumer tool. He of course had a whole bunch of other nice cameras here, but that is another tool that you can't really replace. He doesn't want a GoPro strapped to his head. That doesn't make any sense. Then you, you have the extreme sports. I'm going skiing in a couple weeks with a bunch of friends. I'm sure I'll see a pair of the vanguards out there on the slopes. And then you just have the funny people on Instagram reels saying, computer, give this guy a great day. That comedy is great. Did you see that? That guy ran into another creator that was doing this yelling at him. Yeah, yeah, computer, computer, give this guy a bust down. Ap. Something like that. It was just like very, very funny. And every time I see one on a truly viral Instagram reel, I'm like, okay, there's something here that's unlocking a different form of video. Not unlike when we saw the first GoPro go out and we started seeing truly crazy first person video of surfing. Which, like, was just impossible. Or like I made. I would go surfing. Surfing. I went surfing with Rocco Basiliska, Rocco's Basilisk, the Luxottica exec and AER, who led the project with Meta. Yeah, he took out a new pair of the Oakleys and we did lose them briefly, but we recovered them. They need Meta croakies, right? Isn't that what they're called? Didn't have croakies. Yeah, you need the Meta croakies. Let's get on that Zuck. But anyways, Bloomberg reported that Meta and Luxottica were discussing doubling production to at least 20 million by the end of this year to meet growing demand. So I, I think they're gonna be. They're selling, they're selling. Gotta give them credit. Give Zuck some credit. And again, I saw somebody had effectively jailbroken their meta ray bans and they hooked it up to a Mac Mini and they were buying stuff. I've talked about this at least once on the show, but again, there's that's. It's funny to watch somebody jailbreak a device to do something that the device will obviously do, like in the relative near term. That's like the part of the entire thesis behind the device. But. Yeah, well, I mean, I don't know. Will it actually tell you when you get an imessage in the next three years? Is that coming? I don't know. It might not.
Is saying we talk to, quote, Western manufacturers. And it really doesn't matter whether you're talking about VW or Stellantis or Ford or whatever, just Western manufacturers. And then you talk to Chinese manufacturers. And in China, they're talking one to two years. And then that same conversation with a Western manufacturer is a five year conversation. It's a 2032 conversation instead of like a 2027, 2028 conversation. So the short answer is, you know, there's good AV tech from a lot of places, but frankly, the OEMs are in very, very different positions in terms of their ability to spin up quickly and get a platform out that actually works. Well, congratulations on all the progress. Thank you so much for taking the time to come chat with us. And fantastic shirt, by the way. We love the shirt. Coming in strong. Well, thank you, gentlemen. It means a lot coming from two fashionable guys. Yeah. In the plain white shirt, I'm really taking a risk today. I mean, you're BO on brand for you. You're bold. Yes. In a world of, you know, plain black T shirts of tech, the white collar shirt, white collared shirt does kind of stand out. So thank you. I appreciate it. Hey, congrats to you guys on all your progress and your super bowl ad. That was amazing. That was a lot of fun. It was a good time. A lot of fun. You had a slightly smaller ad than yours, but we're working our way up. We're getting. No, dude, you got to start, you know, step by step by step by step. I will tell you, I did zoom in on all the logos. I was looking for the Lyft logo, it must have been hidden. I don't think I saw it. But anyway, it was. Somebody's getting fired. Tyler is looking into it. Right. We're going to send you evidence if it's in there, if we. But we might have made a mistake. It's possible. There were few that were behind certain letters and so they got. And that was it. I looked very closely. Pretty sure it was hidden. It's no problem at all. I'm not holding it again. We'll figure it out. We take. We're taking it. Good thing the super bowl happens every year. Yeah. Therehere we go. 61, just around the corner. There you go. Great to see you, David. Have a great rest of your day. We'll talk to you soon. Cheers. Thank you. Let me tell you about cognition. They're the makers of Devin, the AI software engineer. Crush your backlog with your personal AI engineering team. And without further ado, Todd McKinnon from Okta is in the Restream waiting room. Welcome to the TVP and Ultram. Todd, how are you doing? What's happening? I am excellent today. Thank you so much for having me on. Thanks for having me on. Thanks for joining. First time on the show. Please kick us off with an introduction. I'm Todd McKinnon. I'm the founder and CEO of Okta. Yeah. And yeah, I'm excited to be here, coming from the office in San Francisco. And I feel like my hair is not nearly good enough to be on the show. It looks fantastic. What are you talking about? I mean, since it's the first time, would you mind going back and the little bit of the history, the story? I love these founder journeys. So you can take as long as you want or as short as you want, but whatever you haven't gotten sick of talking to people about. Yeah, it's interesting. There's a lot of echoes in what's going on today with AI, but 17 years ago, I started Okta the same year Steph Curry. The same year Steph Curry was drafted. No way. I don't know if that makes it seem like a long time ago or not. That.
See this headline which used to say, you know, lift beats on profit or lift beats on whatever, and now, you know, lift shares down, you know, 10% or whatever it is. And so it's such an interesting thing anyway, it's a little bit of a meta point, but like, right now, as a society, it's like we're almost reacting to the reaction more than to the thing itself, which is, which is a little bit mind bending. Yeah, that's, yeah, that's super fascinating. We're reacting, we're, we're, we're letting the bots react and then deciding how we feel based on, based on that. That's exactly right. And the funny thing is the bots are reacting for their own algorithmic reasons that might not particularly be well plugged into any reality anyway. You can go on in this for hours, but it's a little like at the sort of super like, species level we're kind of liking, we're kind of like letting the machines take over a little bit. We're not forming our own opinions, we're letting them tell us what our opinions should be and then reinforcing that, which is a little bit, a little counter to. But anyway, like, of course, some version of this going on for a long time, it's just sort of exaggerated. Now I remember this is something I worked for, as you guys know, Jeff Bezos for a long time. And you know, Amazon, for example, back in the 2000s was, you know, $6 stock or something like this. And people would ask him, like, how do you stay, you know, sort of, sort of focused? He's like, the good news is like, I know the data and this is how I feel too. Like, I was in a meeting yesterday about our self driving car initiative. It's amazing. And I was in another meeting yesterday about our super bowl performance. It was, it was amazing. We were up 13% year on year. We picked people up faster and we took, we were down 20% in surge pricing. In other words, our prices were 20% better than they would have been if we'd had our surge pricing algorithm from last year. Which is great because it means that we're able to do this at a lower cost to customers. So I see the data and I see how well positioned we are right now. So my last thought on this is this is now my new favorite CEO tool. Back to your point. You know what these are? Noise canceling headphones. Noise canceling them. Can you unpack a little bit more of the Waymo partnership, talk about how that's progressing and just broad rollout your plans. How fast do you see that becoming meaningful and growing? For sure. So I'm going to zoom out one click. And just to sort of remind everyone. So I'm super bullish on AV's autonomous vehicles entering the rideshare space. And the reason I'm so bullish is because their market expanding. And we see this in market aftermarket. When AVs come in, people take more rides overall because it's cool. It's a cool new product. It's kind of fun, it's sort of futuristic, it's reliable. So it expands beyond the current population of people who take rideshare today. And then the cost over time will become lower. For example, insurance costs are lower. That'll be pretty obvious. So it's nice when the market expands and when your cost of doing business goes lower. Okay, so then you ask about Waymo. Waymo, of course, is the leader here in the United States, no question. And we have a very specific partnership with them announced in Nashville. That was literally one of the meetings I was in yesterday where we're talking about all of these different ways where we're integrating across.
Business that the big labs won't go after. So fundamentally the model that we're trying to create is different than what big labs might be interested in today, that we are less interested in creating intelligence that's superhuman, that's super rational. But instead what we're interested in creating are models that actually model people's irrational half of their brain. These are people's values, preferences, taste. And the way we go about doing this is a true combination of modeling and product frontier. So simulate is unique in that we as a team actually is composed of both of those talents. So myself and my co founders Michael Bernstein and Percy Liang are all researchers who have been making contributions at the frontier of AI ranging from generative agents to generative AI and foundation models. And there the core mode here is what are the best kind of data that we can collect. And then using that data to create the most high fidelity agents that represent the people we have interviewed, collected data from, then we overlay that on top of amazing product. So here one of the amazing part about the models that actually map people's values and preferences is the better model immediately means better insights for customers like CVS and Gallup. So that there's an amazing alignment between the modeling frontier and product frontier, which is not something that we see every day. So it's a true combination of those two things coming together that makes Simulink special. Yeah. What do you see? Progress scale with more are you compute constrained or is it much more about data constraints? So we are charting the frontier on both front. So down the line. So today we model hundreds of thousands of people who signed up to participate in these studies. And then our customers of course are they have appetite to down the line simulate millions. Our goal eventually is to ask ourselves what would it mean if we can create simulations of 8 billion people, the entire Earth? That's the future that we are headed. So there certainly there's a question around what is the data but also how do we compute these kind of simulations efficiently? Are you worried about getting too accurate? That life just becomes boring? Because free wheel is free will. Do we have free will? Are we living in a simulation? It's like you went to the end of the book and you read the last page and you're just like ah, like. Yeah, there's something fun about actually this discussion. So I don't know if you all have watched the Matrix or I don't know how many of the audience actually have watched the Matrix. I love the Matrix. Amazing. I have seen that one. You have seen that one. Jordy hasn't seen a lot of movies, but he's seen the Matrix. There's actually a quote that I actually like quite a bit that I think it's actually quite profound. It's something that the oracle says, which basically is, you're not necessarily here to make a decision. You've already made that decision. You're here to understand.
I mean, just look at how hard it is to build a data center, which is just a warehouse with computers in it, and then think about building power plants on that same scale. I mean, people have a lot of trouble building solar power, which is zero emissions. And it's fine. It just looks weird. Imagine trying to do that with gas power plants. So I'm a billion AI lawyers in my pocket, just suing everyone left and right. I show up into town, I sue everyone, make friends. Well, I mean, this is a serious concern. You know, litigation risk is a huge issue with energy projects. And one can only imagine what Harvey could do with filing with, you know, gumming up the NEPA process. Oh, yeah. For infrastructure. Yeah. Well, yeah, so I think it's more like we're kind of growing at half a percent a year. Yeah. Maybe 2, maybe 5% some years. 10 would be tough. Okay, well, that's the next bottleneck after the chip bottleneck. Well, I have something. So your friend John Palmer is also our friend. We read his fantastic piece. To me, it was more impactful than something big is coming. Something little is coming. It hit me like a ton of bricks. It really hit us hard. But he just announced that Stripe is acquiring his company. Oh, no way. Party dazer. I wanted to ask, can we hit the gong with you for our friend John? Oh, this would be an honor. Oh, wow. Congratulations. Congratulations, John. This means you have to start buying in bigger, more frequently. Yeah, you have to call my. You have to call my worst bets. No more excuses. Yeah. Poker game Texas. Hold them, no limit Texas. Hold them, no limit Texas. We're actually thinking that maybe the guys, we could get together and start a podcast. I think we'll call it all in. Yeah, kind of like a poker themed little talk about a little business, a little politics, a little tech energy, geopolitics. I think. I think you guys would have something there. Yeah, I know. We'd wear expensive sweaters and. Yeah, it'd be great. I would be the first one to subscribe. Well, it's so great to finally have you on. Come back on when you're going to publish your next story. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks so much. Have a good one. Goodbye. Let me tell you about Plaid. Plaid powers the apps you use to spend, save, borrow, and invest securely. Connecting bank accounts to move money, fight fraud, and improve lending. Now with AI, Is there any other breaking news, Jordi? Anything we need to talk about about before we go? I'm super excited for John Palmer and the PartyDAO team. It's funny. John and I didn't meet until last year, but we used to kind of have this tension because I had a company called Party round. You had partydao. You were doing stunts. We were both in that 20, 21 era. I was doing sort of team of rival situation crypto kind of stunts with Party Round. He was getting quite a lot of attention. We both raised from Andreessen. Whoa. Okay. But now we're.
Transition to renewables. Interesting. The same people are opposing the data centers and they're using the same techniques. They're opposing, say, rezoning agricultural land into industrial land, something really common with solar panels. Same things going on with data centers. Same type of people are opposing it. And it's interesting because at the highest levels of politics, the administration right now is very pro the data center AI buildout. You know, they have, you know, they have Sam Altman at the White House announcing, you know, multibillion dollar investments in this stuff. And yet a lot of data centers are built in Republican areas. That's typically where there's enough space. They tend to kind of be in exurban areas. And yeah, they get a lot of local opposition, a lot of local opposition in Indiana and a lot of local opposition in Kentucky, Virginia. This is really kind of transforming the politics around there as well. So OpenAI has a pack now. Anthropic has a pack now. I think for the drama heads in the chat. We hope that they're just going to fight with each other endlessly and make content for us. But assuming that they want to bring about support, broad support for their data center build out efforts, what would you recommend? What's the playbook for an AI lab that wants to build a gigawatt data center somewhere in America? Where are they going? What promises are they making? What promises can they keep? What would you recommend? Yeah, I mean, we see this in the kind of renewable and nuclear space. A lot is essentially you do a lot of kind of expensive, extensive, long lasting local engagement with the community. And like, look, if you're a data center developer, you're going to end up, you know, building a lot of high school gyms. You're going to really have to get the local people there on board with your project. Because typically the state level you actually, governors like data centers. You know, they provide tax revenue. Unions like data centers. The ibew, International Brotherhood, International Brotherhood Electrical Workers, very pro data center and they're pro data center force in the Democratic party. But oftentimes these decisions are made at these kind of community board meeting, zoning meetings. And for them you really have to convince that you're providing something on the ground. Because what Jordi was saying at the very, very beginning, there's no benefit in terms of what the data center produces to having it near you. Yeah, there's no local AI movement. I want my speak for yourself. I want low latency inference. I want it in my backyard. I'm a yimby. Give me a massive data center. I was hearing bad stuff about living next to a golf course. Tee up one gigawatt data center right there. I'm good to go. I like the idea grown inference. I like the idea of showing up to the local T ball league and being like, why is the team called the Core Weavers? Or something like that? The nuclear power plants famously do this. Yeah. No way. I mean, the Simpsons parodied it. You had the isotopes or whatever. And you do see this in communities of nuclear power plants. But the thing about data centers, they don't provide very many jobs after their.
The business value that could be delivered from these agentic systems. And I think when they can. I was just at my kids soccer game the other day and they were talking about Cloudbot, they were talking about, you know, just these weren't tech people, they're on the sideline and I think they were talking about how powerful it was and how they're going to get restaurant reservations. And I think that catalyzes the side of the equation which is go, go, go. And I think unfortunately you're also going to see more security issues and more connections that were exposed. And Mac Mini with personal data. It wasn't a new Mac Mini. It your family Mac Mini and now your family Mac Mini is, you know, the details are all over the web, you're going to see some of that. And so we have to get both right. We have to get the business value and get people headed in the right direction and then also put the right controls in place. How do you think business models evolve in a world of, you know, potentially millions of agents? Companies aren't really used to running payroll for millions of people, identity for millions of people. Some people are. But how do you think all of that changes going forward? Well, I have a bunch of super strong thoughts on this. Some of them which are maybe counterintuitive. I think first of all, I think in five years there's going to be way more software engineers than there are today. And it's a little bit of a trick answer because. Mainly because I think there's going to be way more software and they'll be more productive, but you'll have more software engineers, I guarantee you. All these companies, Meta, Amazon, Google, Anthropic, they'll have more software engineers in five years than they do today. And double clicking on that. Do you think it's that we're going to see more computer science degrees become software engineers in the traditional sense? Or that designer that you have, that pm, that business leader, maybe even your CFO all of a sudden is a software engineer or is creating software. I think what a software engineer does. But I'm not trying to cop out and say all people are going to be vibe coding and that's my software engineer account. I mean people building and architecting software and knowing internals of how it works. They're not going to be writing as much code clearly. But I'll give you a secret. For the last 30 years we've had integrated development environments that are helping us write code more efficiently. This is a whole nother level, but it's not a new thing to get better tools to help us make software. So there's going to be more software engineers but there's going to be even more than the increase in software engineers. There's going to be way more software which is super exciting and super super daunting. Now back now if you layer on you know are people going to build all their own software, buy software for vendors? I think that is unequivocally they're going to buy more software from vendors for sure. Yeah. Now the trick you kind of people. Have to people that are just bearish on enterprise software have to remember that there's been open source equivalents of like every major platform forever. Yeah. It's like you could just pick it off the shelf and run it, maintain it and it's easy, right? Yeah. And I think kind of like there's going to be this kind of goes back with my first thing I said about more software.
It could be any number of people who are producing this technology independent of the oem. When you talk to them, their biggest frustration, I'm actually going to quote one of them right now, is saying, we talk to Western manufacturers, and it really doesn't matter whether you're talking about VW or Stellantis or Ford or whatever, just Western manufacturers. And then you talk to Chinese manufacturers, and in China, they're talking one to two years. And then that same conversation with a Western manufacturer is a five year conversation. It's a 2032 conversation instead of a 2027, 2028 conversation. So the short answer is there's good AV tech from a lot of places, but frankly, the OEMs are in very, very different positions in terms of their ability to spin up quickly and get a platform out that actually works. Well. Congratulations on all the progress. Thank you so much for taking the time to come chat with us. And fantastic shirt, by the way. We love the shirt. Coming in strong. Well, thank you, gentlemen. It means a lot coming from two fashionable guys. Yeah. In the plain white shirt, I'm really taking a risk today. I mean, you're bold. It's on brand for you. You're bold. Yes. In a world of plain black T shirts of tech. White collared shirt. White collared shirt does kind of stand out. So thank you. I appreciate it. Hey, congrats to you guys on all. Your progress and your super bowl ad. That was amazing. Thank you. That was a lot of fun. It was a good time. A lot of fun. Slightly smaller ad than yours, but we're working our way up. We're getting. No, dude, you got to start, you know, step by step by step by step. I will tell you, I did zoom in on all the logos. I was looking for the Lyft logo. It must have been hidden. I don't think I saw it. But anyway, it was. Somebody's getting fired. Tyler is looking into it right now. We're gonna send you evidence if it's in there, if we. But we might have made a mistake. It's possible. There were a few that were behind certain letters, and so they got. And that was it. I looked very closely. Okay. Pretty sure it was hidden. It's no problem at all. I'm not holding it again. We'll figure it out. We take. We're taking it. Good thing the super bowl happens every year. Yeah. There we go. 61. It's just around the corner. There you go. Great to see you, David. Have a great rest of your day. We'll talk to you soon. Cheers. Thank you. Let me tell you about cognition. They're the makers of Devon, the AI software engineer. Crush your backlog with your personal AI engineering team. And without further ado, Todd McKinnon from Okta is in the restream waiting room. Welcome to the TV Penultrome. Todd, how are you doing? What's happening? I am excellent today. Thank you so much for having me on. Thanks for having me on. First time on the show. Please kick us off with an introduction. I'm Todd McKinnon. I'm the founder and CEO of Okta. Yeah. And, yeah, I'm excited to be here, coming from the office in San Francisco, and I feel like my hair is not nearly good enough to be on the show. It looks fantastic. What are you talking about? Come on. I mean, since it's the first time, would you mind going back and telling us a little bit of the history, the story? I love these founder journeys, so you can take as long as you want or as short as you want, but whatever you haven't gotten sick of talking to people about. Yeah, it's interesting. There's a lot of echoes in what's going on today with AI.
Narrative of why it's happening that then gets turned into an article that then. Other people are reading 100%. And remember, a lot of people don't. Read much beyond the first paragraph. And so they'll just see this headline. Which used to say, lift beats on profit or Lift beats or whatever. And now lift shares down 10% or whatever it is. And so it's such an interesting thing. Anyway, it's a little bit of a. Meta point, but right now, as a. Society, it's like we're almost reacting to. The reaction more than to the thing itself, which is a little bit mind bending. Yeah, that's super fascinating. We're reacting, we're letting the bots react and then deciding how we feel based on that. That's exactly right. And the funny thing is the bots. Are reacting for their own algorithmic reasons. That might not particularly be well plugged. Into any reality anyway. You can go on in this for hours, but it's a little like at the sort of super like, species level. We'Re kind of liking. We're kind of like letting the machines. Take over a little bit. We're not forming our own opinions, we're letting them tell us what our opinions. Should be and then reinforcing that, which is a little bit, a little counter to. But anyway, like, of course, some version. Of this going on for a long time, it's just sort of exaggerated. Now I remember this is something I worked for, as you guys know, Jeff Bezos for a long time. And you know, Amazon, for example, back in the 2000s was, you know, $6 stock or something like this. And people would ask him, like, how. Do you stay, you know, sort of, sort of focus? He's like, the good news is like, I know the data and this is how I feel too. Like I was in a meeting yesterday. About our self driving car initiative. It's amazing. And I was in another meeting yesterday. About our super bowl performance. It was amazing. We were up 13% year on year. We picked people up faster and we took. We were down 20% in surge pricing. In other words, our prices were 20% better than they would have been if we'd had our surge pricing algorithm from last year. Which is great because it means that we're able to do this at a lower cost to. So I see the data and I. See how well positioned we are right now. So my last thought on this is this is now my new favorite CEO tool. Back to your point. You know what these are? Noise canceling headphones. Noise canceling them. Can you unpack a little bit more of the Waymo partnership, talk about how that's progressing, and just broad rollout your plans. How fast do you see that becoming meaningful and growing? For sure. So I'm going to zoom out one. Click and, you know, just to sort of remind everyone. So I'm super bullish on AVs. Autonomous vehicles entering the rideshare space. And the reason I'm so bullish is because they're, they're market expanding. You know, when, when we see this in market after market, when AVs come in, people take more rides overall because it's cool. It's a. It's a cool new product. It's kind of fun. It's sort of futuristic. It's reliable. So it expands beyond the current population of people who take rides here today. And then the cost over time will become lower. For example, insurance costs are lower. That'll be pretty obvious. So it's nice when the market expands and when your cost of doing business goes lower. Okay, so then you ask about Waymo. Waymo, of course, is the leader here in the United States, no question.
The analysts are going to ask and is it that that strategy only yields two accurate questions and you're at a higher benchmark rate? Or do you think that there's a different piece of your business that the big labs won't go after? So fundamentally the model that we're trying to create is different than what big labs might be interested in today, that we are less interested in creating intelligence that's superhuman, that's super rational, but instead what we are interested in creating is, are models that actually model people's irrational path of their brain. These are people's values, preferences, taste. And the way we go about doing this is a true combination of modeling and product frontier. So simulate is unique in that we as a team actually is composed of both of those talents. So myself and my co founders Michael Bernstein and Percy Liang are all researchers who have been making contributions and at the frontier of AI ranging from generative agents to generative AI and foundation models. And there the core mode here is what are the best kind of data that we can collect. And then using that data to create the most high fidelity agents that represent the people we have interviewed, collected data from. And then we overlay that on top of amazing product. So here one of the amazing part about the models that that actually map people's values and preferences is the better model immediately means better insights for customers like CVS and Gallup. So that there's an amazing alignment between the modeling frontier and product frontier, which is not something that we see every day. So it's a true combination of those two things coming together that makes Simulink special. Yeah. What do you see? Progress scale with more are you compute constrained or is it much more about data constraints? So we are charting the frontier on both front. So down the line. So today we model hundreds of thousands of people who signed up to participate in these studies and then our customers, of course they have appetite to down the line simulate millions. Our goal eventually is to ask ourselves what would it mean if we can create simulations of 8 billion people, the entire Earth? That's the future that we are headed. So there certainly there's a question around what is the data but also how do we compute these kind of simulations efficiently? Yeah. Are you worried about getting too accurate? That life just becomes boring? Because is freewheel is free will real? Do we have free will? Are we living in a simulation? It's like you went to the end of the book and you read the last page and you're just like ah, like. There'S something fun about actually this discussion So I don't know if you all have watched the Matrix or I don't know how many of the audience actually have watched the Matrix. I love the Matrix. Amazing. I have seen that one. You have seen that one? Jordy hasn't seen a lot of movies, but he's seen the Matrix. There's actually a quote that I actually like quite a bit that I think it's actually.
What is your feeling around this idea that we might actually start seeing 10% growth rates in energy production nationally? I mean, just look at how hard it is to build a data center, which is just a warehouse with computers in it, and then think about building power plants on that same scale. I mean, people have a lot of trouble building solar power, which is zero emissions. And it's fine. It looks weird. Imagine trying to do that with gas. With gas power plants. So what if I were going to. Go in AI, lawyers in my pocket, just suing everyone left and right. I show up into town, I sue everyone, make friends. Well, I mean, this is a serious concern. You know, litigation risk is a huge issue with energy projects. And one can only imagine what Harvey could do with filing with, you know, gumming up the NEPA process for infrastructure. Yeah, well, yeah, so I think it's. More like we're kind of growing at half a percent a year, maybe two, maybe 5%. Some years. Ten would be tough. Okay, well, that's the next bottleneck after the chip bottleneck. Well, I have something. So your friend John Palmer is also our friend. We read his fantastic piece. To me, it was more impactful than something big is coming. Something little. It hit me like a ton of bricks. It really hit us hard. But he just announced that Stripe is acquiring his company. Oh, no way. Arty Dazzler. I wanted to ask, can we hit the gong with you for our friend John? Oh, this would be an honor. Oh, wow. Congratulations. Congratulations, John. This means you have to start buying in bigger, more frequently. Yeah, you have to call my worst bets. No more excuses. Poker game. All in Texas hold'. Em. No limit. Texas hold'. Em. We were actually thinking that maybe the guys, we could get together and start a podcast. I think we'd call it All In. Yeah, kind of like a poker themed. Talk about a little business, a little politics, a little tech, energy, geopolitics. I think you guys would have something there. Yeah, I know. We'd wear expensive sweaters and. Yeah, it'd be great. I would be the first one to subscribe. Well, it's so great to finally have you on. Come back on when you are going to publish your next story. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks so much. Have a good one. Cheers. Goodbye. Let me tell you about Plaid. Plaid Powers. The apps used to spend, save, borrow and invest securely. Connecting bank accounts to move money, fight fraud, and improve lending. Now with AI, is there any other breaking news? Jordi, anything we need to talk about before we. I'm super excited for John Palmer and the Partydao team. It's funny, John and I didn't meet until last year. Yeah. But we used to kind of have this, like, tension because I had a company called Party Round. You had Party Dao. We're both in that 20, 21 era. I was doing sort of team of rival situation crypto.
Meta Hedge fund manager Bill Ackman likes Mark Zuckerberg's chances in AI. Pershing Square revealed the stake at an annual meeting of one of its fund on Wednesday. The position amounted to 10% of the firm's capital at the end of 2025, or roughly 2 billion based on past disclosures. Meta shares are down about 13% over the past six months, a decline that Pershing Square attributes to investor concerns about the sums the company is spending on AI Capex. Pershing's thesis revolves in part around AI boosting Meta's content recommendation and personalized ads, and potentially unlocking new opportunities in wearables or AI digital assistants for businesses. Ben Thompson Keep reading. I'm going to pull up Meta's business. Model is one of the clearest beneficiaries of AI integration, pershing Square said in its presentation. Ackman tends to concentrate his stock portfolio in a small number of high conviction bets. He only had 13 different positions at the end of 2025, including other big tech companies, Alphabet and Amazon. What did you say? You disliked me for real? You co tweeted this, right? Yeah, there's a. I mean I didn't like really add anything. I just posted a Jeremy Giffon, you. Created this post and you photoshopped Jeremy's name on there because it was your idea. It came from you. What did Jeremy say? I just want to give him credit. He said the idea that it's hard to beat the market is mostly trotted out by money managers. What they really mean is that it's hard to do when you manage other people's money because it's difficult to get paid for doing the obvious thing. I think it's substantially easier than most people think for the person solely running their own cash. So Ackman is charging 2 and 20 to own the Mag 7. You love to see it, but a lot of people don't have diamond hands. He will diamond hands for you by holding Alphabet, Amazon and Meta, apparently. Let me tell you about Railway. We're Railway is the all in one intelligent cloud provider. Use your favorite agent to deploy web apps, servers, databases and more while Railway takes automatically takes care of scaling modern security. Speaking of Meta, ray ban maker Luxottica says it more than tripled Meta AI glasses sales in 2025. Take off. The French Italian eyewear brand said it sold over 7 million AI glasses last year, up from 2 million that the company sold in 2023 and 2024 combined. Wait, so sorry, say that number again. How many did they sell last year? 7 million devices last year. I think I'm starting to see them. I mean, Ashlee Vance came on the show and was wearing them for fun, but also for good content. He's gonna actually include that content in the stuff that he makes. It's a video maker's tool, so it's a prosumer tool. He, of course, had a whole bunch of other nice cameras here, but that is another tool that you can't really replace. He doesn't want a GoPro strapped to his head. That doesn't make any sense. Then you have the extreme sports. I'm going sk in a couple of weeks with a bunch of friends. I'm sure I'll see a pair of the vanguards out there on the slopes, and then.
X to promote Higsfield. Wow. All this hype is fake and it's bought. Sora told Forbes. Higsfield's co founder and chief strategy officer Mahi told Forbes the media kit was created by an employee in the startup's marketing team for ideation purposes and was inadvertently shared with creators, saying the company's processes went haywire. With its library of 400 presets of camera motions and visual effects, SF based Higgs field offers an easy way for creators and advertisers to produce cinematic short videos. Videos through text based prompts. You guys already know this, Mahi says. We fully admit that we pushed the envelope. We learned from what works on platforms like X and very explicitly. It's more controversial content that gets attention. So that's translated into hockey stick Revenue growth. Last month, the startup claimed it doubled its annualized revenue to 200 million in just two weeks, driven largely by subscriptions from its 300,000 paying users. Wow. By early February, its annual run rate crossed 300 million. CEO Alex told Forbes that he hopes to reach 1 billion by the end of the year. After raising 80 million from firms like Excel and Menlo in mid January, the startup is now in talks to raise funding again. But that rapid growth appears to be driven by aggressive, shocking and sometimes misleading marketing tactics. Anyways, they're moving very quickly. It was interesting when we asked Alex about his margins, he, he kind of, he seemed kind of, he gave kind of a concerning response. He immediately was like, yeah, well when. You'Re reselling a model, you are at risk there. At the same time, with a different business model, with a different customer acquisition flow, it's possible to have good margins on top of models if it's deeply embedded. But I've actually been getting served a whole bunch of Higgs Field, spawncon or like how to videos that are amazing. A lot of them are testaments to the power of the underlying models. Like nanobanana. I saw there's this cool video where this creator was talking about how hard it is to film yourself. Let's say you want to do one of those cool I'm locked in videos which I really enjoy. And you want the camera to be here getting a profile shot of you and then flip around, go behind you, over your shoulder, then spin around, show your face, then go and inside the keyboard that can be a really, really hard shot to get. You might need like a automated camera or robot. Like you need a Kuka robot arm to do that move. MKBHD has one, but they're very, very expensive. Hundreds of thousands of dollars. Not every creator can afford one. And so he was basically showing this workflow where he will film himself on a tripod here. Move the tripod. Move the tripod. Move the tripod. And then put in the start and end frames into nanobanana Pro. And then it interpolates those and does the sweeping move. And because it's all in motion, there's motion blur, and it has two reference frames of, like.
With an eye toward increasing its holdings and pressuring the company to negotiate with Paramount. I wonder if they're friends with the Ellisons. Interesting Paramount's gamble. Paramount is hoping its latest pitch can persuade Warner to ditch its agreement and sell its movie and TV studios and HBO Max streaming service to Netflix. Unlike Netflix, Paramount also intends to buy Warner Discovery's cable networks, which includes cnn, TBS and Food Network. But Warner has so far shown little interest in engaging with Paramount, telling investors that Ellison's previous offer was not even comparable to the Netflix agreement. On Tuesday, Warner said its board will review Paramount's new offer, but it but isn't modifying its recommendation regarding its agreement with Netflix. The company advised shareholders to not take any action now regarding Paramount's amended tender offer. The bar for Warner to reopen talks with Paramount is very high given its contract with Netflix. A massive termination fee. Paramount said it would pay the 2.8 billion. Let's give it up for multi billion dollar termination fees. Love those. Warner would owe Netflix should the agreed to deal collapse and pay a ticking fee of 25 cents a share to Warner shareholders for each quarter its deal hasn't closed. Whoa, we got ticking fees, ticking time bomb. Some stakeholders are holding out for Paramount to further boost its bid. I'm not surprised given that they've repeatedly said with their offers, this is not our best and final offer. Analysts from Raymond James wrote in a note to clients that many Warner Discovery shareholders still expect Paramount and its backers to raise its $30 a share bid by 2 to $3 a share. So everyone is waiting around saying let's get those numbers up. Remind me of how Paramount is doing right now. They have ufc. Correct. And the experience watching UFC was a downgrade from pay per view, but cheaper. What was the takeaway? Well, I mean, I don't think we can like give an analysis of Paramount as an entire business based on everything looks good. The experience was not as good as paying for the pay per view. And was that because you had to go through all the. You had to jump through all the hoops to sign up for Paramount plus and you weren't already a member? No. The viewing experience was different because it's now subscription and ad supported. Whereas previously pay per views had ads, but not nearly as much. So the thing you're missing now watching is in round commentary, walkouts, things that hardcore fans really like. Is there less Joe Rogan commentary? Basically brutal, brutal. The markets are reacting. Paramount's down 7% today. That might be the good day. Of course, not just this analysis of the UFC viewing experience? Yes. But no. The stock dip was apparently in reaction to the breakup fee, people being like, oh, great, you're going to pay even more.
And getting obsessed with these tools and then bring them into the enterprise. Because it's very easy for a lot of people in Fortune 500 companies to just show up and do their job the way they always do it because no one gets fired for switching things up. But if you roll out some tool and it doesn't work the way you intended or it sucks about a bunch of your time, even if you're just. I have eight hours of work to do in my traditional system. Where do you get the extra hours to automate your work? It takes time and that's where the forward deployed engineers come in. So great gig for anyone who wants to go implement enterprise agentic workflows because that will be the theme. Let me tell you about phantom cash. Fund your wallet without exchanges or middlemen and spend with the phantom card. Let's pull up this chart. Andrew Kern over on X pulled it out. We can see Anthropic's run rate, revenue growth. See here. Quite the pop from $0 in 2023 to 100 million in Jan. Of 2024 to a clean 1 billion in January 2025. And now sitting at 14 billion. This is acceleration. This is. This is true. Feeling it yet? True acceleration. I'm feeling it. Dario sort of underplayed 2027, I guess. Or I guess he said that. He was like, I don't think we have another 10x if they go to 100 billion. Well, he said like we've been 10xing. Yeah, you know, we, we'll see if we do it again. Yeah, like wink, wink. But if they, if they hit 140 billion run rate by the end of the year, that would be insane. But strange times, strange times. You love this effect. That's all, folks. I mean, Tyler's been saying stuff along these lines for some time. So Okta. Okta helps you assign every AI agent a trusted identity so you get the power of AI without the risk. Secure every agent. Secure any agent. We have a CEO of Opta coming on the show. Pumped for that. Back to the timeline. There are more. More in Anthropic. Nathan Lambert was quoting their announcement from yesterday saying, we're committing to covering electricity price increases from our data centers. This is anthropic. Oh, yes. To ensure ratepayers aren't picking up the tab, we'll pay 100% of grid upgrade costs, work to bring new power online, and invest in systems to reduce grid strain. This makes so much sense. Yeah. Nathan saying that maybe this should have been their super bowl ad. Yeah. Yeah, it felt like when you looked at. When you kind of look at clearly how much energy the industry put into the Super Bowl. Yeah. And what the net effect was for the average American. I don't think any. I don't think the average American came away from that, like, having more positive feelings towards AI. Yeah. If anything, they were like, I'm sick of this stuff. Yeah. The meme was like, oh, beer ads, like, refreshing. Yeah. It would have been good to focus on this. Microsoft did this, what? A couple months ago, the news was on.
Medium, build me an app. An amazing app. The best app ever. One that will win awards and make me a legend in Silicon Valley. An award winning app. An award winning app. And it appears to be working. Let's see. We'll check in on this. I need to run it. No, it's running it. I don't know. It's describing it. It hasn't said what it's thinking of. Doing, but it says, you don't need to know that, John. You don't need to know that. More seriously, John Palmer's PO feels like a response to Will's essay Tool shaped objects, which is fantastic. We won't read through Will's whole essay because I think you should read it yourself. And he might be coming on the show soon. Yeah, we're getting him on the show tomorrow, which we're excited about. But we do love reading a Will Menidis essay laced with tons and tons of advertising. We know that that's one of his favorite things. And we'll read one right now for the New York Stock Exchange. Want to change the world? Raise capital at the New York Stock Exchange. Just do it, Anthropic. Anthropic is nearing the completion of a deal to raise more than 20 billion in a funding round led by investors including Peter thiel's founders fund, D.E. shaw and Dragonier. Let's dig in. Of course, being a little bit silly with the pronunciation Sydney over on X, which said British AI researcher be like Anthropic. So I'm going to start integrating that into, into my sentences as well. Anthropic is nearing the completion of a deal to raise more than 20 billion in a funding round led by the group I just mentioned. The deal is set to value anthropic at about 350 billion, nearly doubling its prior value, and could be announced as early as this week. The funding round includes a range of investors, including CO2, Singapore's GIC, Microsoft, Nvidia, and has become a who's who of Silicon Valley and Wall street investors. I think it's worth kind of talking about this just from a PT lens. Yeah. I don't know if you want to break it down, given that. Yeah, he's a boss. Yes. So Founders Fund is known for the monopoly thesis. Like there's a power law. You want to be in the best company in the category, you want the best ownership. Put all your money in that one. Yeah, I'll go all in. Famously, they did some other social networking deals, but obviously, like Facebook was the big one at seed and that was enough to return that fund many times over. And so the whole thesis of the fund for a long time has been like this. Concentrated bets. Concentrated bets. AI has been an interesting one. They're now in three major labs because they have a huge position in SpaceX, which now owns XAI, and so they're in that lab, sort of coincidentally. Peter Thiel, I believe, is listed on Wikipedia as a co founder of OpenAI, or at least he was like an initial.
But then other things like peptides that are very promising, they're not going to have the clinical work. So what do you do? So if we could get a certain number of people on the platform who are doing peptides, great. And if they can start adding dimensionality to their bio collection, we could have the most valuable data set. So it's Immortals is the product that's the high end right now, but then also the free version we're building. And our goal is to create the world's largest data set across all these actors. And then you basically can create an ecosystem where the person could be paid for their data. So they collect the data they're starting to the experimentation. Companies come in and buy the data they give out. So we're trying to create this financially incentivized ecosystem where, like in the world right now you can't go anywhere without somebody or something trying to take advantage of you. Like, it's, it's just everywhere. Like, try to think of a company that genuinely acts in your best interest. Like unequivocally always shows up to act in your best interest. Diet Coke. It's always there when John needs it, except when the flight attendant says, how about Pepsi? Yeah, that's true. We're going to try to stand in that role where we're all so jaded because everyone's trying to take advantage of us. So we're going to try to stand in that role that you can unequivocally trust us. We will always act in your best interest. And if we do that, then I'm willing to share my data, I'm willing to engage in the platform and do the exploration. So high bar, I want to run through kind of a lightning round of questions. What have you learned from Ray Pete? That there's a lot of repeaters on X. Yeah. And they really want you to follow their. Yeah, they do. They want you to Pete out. They do, yeah. So they're definitely evangelists. So Ray Pete has a lot of evangelists. Carrots. Underrated. Overrated. Yeah. Carrots are a great food. You know, they're not benign. Like, no food is benign. It has pros and cons. What else you got, Jordy? Where would you live if you weren't a public figure? You could just optimize for health. Yeah, Kate's here. Hey, Kate. Hey, Kate. Yeah, we were just having this conversation. She's from Australia. We were just having this conversation, trying to figure that out. It's really an interesting question. LA is certainly not the place if you're purely optimizing for health yeah yeah. That'S very true so it has been top of mind for us and we are trying to figure out if we did something next level where would we go and how we do it I wouldn't have an answer yet. Yeah yeah I think it's an important question there's data on golf courses I don't know if you've seen this I have if you live near a golf course it reduces your life expectancy because they use such heavy pesticides on the golf course because how close to the golf course there's one in my town that's probably not great these studies were done on like people that live in like a golf. Oh like right so like you're living on the golf course and they're they're basically know golfers just want it to look pretty they're not asking like hey what did you do to make it look so pretty Realistic golfing what are your long term kind of concerns around the health of us being.
About how just load growth was coming, that we'd essentially had flat electricity demand in the 21st century. And when I wrote the story, it was more about electrification of cars and home heating, heat pump, stuff like that, stuff that climate people are really interested in. And then in data centers to some extent. Also factories are something I was really looking into as a big electricity demand. And then, yeah, I mean, it was since the growth of, since the launch of GPT3, it became pretty clear that data centers was where it was at at.
Like curling is like, you know, the most regimented or whatever. Obviously, everybody's different. But what do you think the. What do you think the best athletes in the world are doing this Olympics? Like, what's cutting edge that maybe normal people aren't thinking about? Yeah. So, I mean, this also showed up in the NFL a little while ago, but people are taking vasodilators, you know, Viagra and tadalafil, commonly goes by Cialis. You know, tadalafil is a vasodilator, lowers blood pressure, and people know of it as Cialis for erectile dysfunction. Right. But it was originally developed as a drug to improve prostate health, because when you vasodilate, when you dilate the vasculature, you get more perfusion of the prostate, and you need perfusion of the prostate. Avoid infections, but other things as well. So the basic takeaway is that Most every male 40 and older should probably be taking somewhere between 2.5 and 5 milligrams of tadalafil, not necessarily for erectile function, although it will augment that as well, but to lower blood pressure and to improve vasodilation for the brain, for the prostate. And I'm not saying this as a biohacker or a podcaster. We had our head of male sexual health from Stanford. His name is Mike eisenberg. He's an MD, PhD. He is best in class in terms of male sexual health, endocrinology, et cetera. And that's his recommendation. And it's one that most every male, maybe 35, but at least 40 and older, should take just as a preventative, you know, strokes. So you don't think that'll. People are taking it. Athletes are taking it as effectively some type of performance. To lower anxiety pregame because it lowers your blood pressure a little bit. They think it might be a performance enhancer by delivering more blood to the muscles. You have to look at what's on the banned list, and there's obviously lots of things on the banned list, and then they're going to be the things that people are going to use because they're not on the banned list, and they'll be banned the next Olympics. That's often how it goes. So I pay a lot of attention to this over the years. If you looked in the 90s, you saw things like bromocriptine apomorphine, things that people who know those names will augment acetylcholine dopamine in order to improve fast transmission of neurons and alertness and focus for getting quickest out the blocks and sprinting, for instance. Those drugs are now banned. Okay, you'll see in sports where staying calm is an advantage. Any shooting sport, for instance, most of the banned drugs are things that lower heart rate. Imagine skiing up to a target, picking up your gun and shooting. The less you're shaking, the better. So there's a bunch of banned drugs, and then there are all the things that people will take to lower their blood pressure. And some of those are not banned. And this is kind of how the cycle goes. We heard about the skiers injecting their penises in order to expand their bulge size. I guess it were in order to get a little more air resistance, in order to perhaps capture a little more airtime. That was hit the press mostly because it's kind of. It's kind of humorous when we think about it. That was really. If you look at any sport, you're going to see this, you're going to see this, you're going to see peptides like BPC157, I believe is banned. But that's a naturally occurring gut peptide. Very hard to test for because you have tons of it circulating. And the synthetic versions may or may not differ from that version so much that you can detect it.
Things that you can do. Digging up historical data, all the data that you have. But there is just this natural break on progress when you have to wait for results and then feed that back in 100%. Makes sense. You talked about testing. What are you finding in organic products? If something's organic, do you just automatically assume that it's not going to kill you? I assume. It'S worse than not. Organic. No, I'm serious. Junkyard dog theory. I'm. Vindicated. It's true. Honestly, Organic only.
These things might last three or four hundred thousand miles, but unlike a normal used car, they'll have zero value at the end. Right? Zero value. No one's going to buy a used AV that's been on the road for 400,000 miles and uses old tech. So, okay, that's a whole financing model that people have to figure out. Then there's got to be all the stuff that we were just talking about, all the fleet management stuff, and that's physical world stuff, right? That's like, who's going to charge these things? Who's going to reboot them when they need rebooting? Who's going to clean them when someone, you know, throws up in the car, all these things, and then who's going to maintain them? And then you have to have all the demand management and so forth.
Yeah, Hard to fit into Axe. Yeah, so. So there's been a lot of studies on the impact of social media on people's mental health, brain, young people, teenagers. What about. And then right now one of the most popular words in the world is or phrases. Brain rot. Right. Are there any large scale studies being done on the impact of consuming an hour or two hours a day of short form video? Like, what are you tracking? Because if you just look at the data YouTube has, I forget the exact number, but the average person in the world is watching like a meaningful amount of shorts every day. So some people are watching hundreds and hundreds, others are watching zero or maybe a few. Yeah, but there's a range. Yeah. Well, I'll just offer a tool that I think is very useful. I mean, I don't have problems with behavioral restraint, but I. But I do have a lockbox for my social media phone. So I took an old phone, I put social media on that phone so that if people text me social media links, I can't open them. It also means that when I take out that phone, I'm posting or commenting or doing that. And I keep it in this lockbox, which is like a supermax prison. You can't even code out of it. It has a no code out setting. And I'll leave it in there about 20 plus hours a day. And it's just great. It's just great. I mean, your productivity will go through the roof. I mean, it's getting very easy to blow past your peers now just by avoiding being on social media a little bit more. I mean, David Goggins said this is like, it's easier than ever now to be successful if you just don't do certain things. Whereas in the past it was like, what do I have to do to be successful? Like, the shortest productivity self help book will be, you know, lock your social media phone in a box for 23 hours a day. And then I do think that. So I'm not aware of any studies looking at one.
Really dangerous and foolish, especially in people younger than 40, right? Well, especially because.
Data constraints. So we are charging the frontier on both front. So down the line. So today we model hundreds of thousands of people who signed up to participate in these studies. And then our customers of course are they have appetite to down the line, simulate millions. Our goal eventually is to ask ourselves what would it mean if we can create simulations of 8 billion people, the entire Earth? That's the future that we're headed. So there certainly there's a question around what is the data? But also how do we compute these kind of simulations efficiently? Yeah. Are you worried about getting too accurate? That life just becomes boring? Because free will. Is free will real? Do we have free will? It's like, are we living in a simulation? It's like you've read, you, you went to the end of the book and you read the last page and you're just like, yeah, like. Yeah, there's something fun about actually this discussion. So I don't know if you all have watched the Matrix or I don't know how many of the audience actually have watched the Matrix. I love the Matrix. Amazing. I have seen that one. You have seen that one. Jordy hasn't seen a lot of movies, but he's seen the Matrix. There's actually a quote that I actually like quite a bit that I think it's actually quite profound. It's something that the Oracle says, which basically is you're not necessarily here to make a decision. You've already made a decision, you're here to understand the decision and why you made that. And that sort of captures essence of simulation. The models that we're creating isn't merely trying to predict the future, although we are good at that and that is one of the core capability. But what to me is more important is understanding why we made the decision that we created and creating these kind of bottom up simulation where we can actually go back and actually trace through the audit logs of how society might unfold is actually an amazing way to gain that interpretability layer of our reality. So that is to me the best way to shape the future. If you want to shape new policies, new product that would actually serve the people that is in our society. The best way is actually to understand those people and then actually communicating with them at a scalable way to basically create those policies. So that's how we view things. How much did you raise before that? The chat wants to know. Do you think if you worked with Clavicular, the live streamer, you would be able to predict whether or not he would get frame mogged if he went to different locations or maybe universities. Maybe you could have said, don't go to asu. Just don't. Just don't. How much did you raise?
Would I suggest anyone else do that in their 20s or 30s, unless they have a serious issue with peptides? There's the risk of where you're getting it from. Purity, right? But there's also the risk that if you're augmenting growth hormone in your teens, your 20s, you can really mess up your hypothalamic, pituitary, body axis, all the organs of your body in major ways. You shut down fertility. If you come off these things, you may revert to a state of depression, et cetera. I just think the whole looks maxing phenomenon is really, really dangerous and foolish, especially in people younger.
For me, is 2026 the best year to move to San Francisco in history. Oh, now you've got me. You're getting me really worked up now. My strong conviction. I love San Francisco, and I think all of these people that said San Francisco is dead and it's a mess was totally overblown. San Francisco is an amazing, beautiful place. And no matter, you know, is the government perfect? No. Is any government perfect? No. But it's an amazing place, and all the people still want to come here. Yeah. You look at. I mean, how many people moved to Miami are now coming back? I mean. Where are the great companies being started? I think I love San Francisco Tech is just behind me. That says San Francisco. Yeah. You got a. Yeah, you got. A. Bridge. Got. A bridge. Hey, we think somebody. Somebody should. We think that the Golden Gate is not really gold. Yeah, but. But. Your gate. Was gold. We think you should. You should sponsor. You should pitch the city to sponsor the Golden Gate Bridge. Yeah, that's. It's wide open. Let's put it. It is. It's a begin metaphor. Hanging under it. Your identity as you go into the city. This is great. Connect Marin to Fort Point. Yeah. Yes. This is integration. This is fantastic.
Really high THC concentrates that you can buy at the convenience store. And then people with a predisposition are having psychotic episodes. Here are a couple of things. I'll say one thing facetious and then a couple things serious. One, I really love to compete with people who like cannabis because unless they're a martial artist or a creative, like a musician, you're gonna blast past them. So, you know, it's kind of like recommending great Netflix series to your competitors, right? Yeah. Or Remote Work, I recommend. You're gonna win. Okay, now that's the facet. The serious side is, you know, couple guys or friends, gals, two getting together and smoking some weed. And one person's like, oh, this really calms my anxiety, makes them feel as if they can engage socially. And the next thing you know, they're losing motivation for a bunch of other things layered on top of social media. The challenges of life as they always existed, but also nowadays. And the next thing you know, you've got somebody with some serious mental health issues and a full blown addiction. I do know that my colleagues that work on addiction, Dr. Anna Lemke, who's an MD who wrote dopamine, Keith Humphries at Stanford, they'll tell you that many, many more people are coming to them of all ages saying they struggle with cannabis. I will also say that you're not going to get REM sleep if you are ingesting cannabis, certainly within a few hours of sleep. Anyone that quits cannabis will tell you that their REM sleep, their dreams, just comes back like crazy for many months, if not years. And you need REM sleep to offload the emotional load of prior day experiences. So I get it. And then the last thing is that there's always the comparison to alcohol. I actually did a post about this on X, but it's crazy, right? I mean, I've talked about alcohol before. Zero is better than any two per week. You're probably fine. If you're going to drink more, do more things for it to support your lifestyle. I'm not a teetotaler. Do as you want, but know what you're doing. But people always say it's better than alcohol, as if you had to pick one. And maybe you do. Maybe in order to socialize, people feel like they have to pick one. I don't know. I've always been able to say whatever the heck is on my mind and without any alcohol or drugs. So you don't want to be around me if I were drunk, because I'll tell everyone everything, you know. But no, I do it anyway. And I think it's just an issue of I get it. In your teens and 20, late teens and 20s, college, 30s, when you go to a bar, you don't want to sit around and necessarily sober. I get it. So what are you going to do? You can have a couple of drinks or weed. Which one is better? It really depends on who you are and the comparison is just kind of a fool's errand. You're never going to solve what's better. But there are many, many more people smoking or ingesting high THC cannabis. And you have examples of people who are extremely successful, extremely ambitious who use cannabis. But those people probably need it to not go over the peak of anxiety from their ambition. They're using it to stay in a healthy zone. Whereas people that are have more apathy, they're less motivated, they should stay away from cannabis in my opinion, if they want to make something of their life.
Formed, you were in a completely different landscape than if you're 14, 18, 20. You know, I worry very much we're hearing more and more about young people, especially women in the past, but now also young guys who are thinking, oh, you know, they've got to take trt. That's crazy. You know, I've talked about the fact that at 45, I'm 50 now, 45 years old, I started taking a microdose of cypionate. Microdose, but micro. So I maintain fertility. I've checked that. I take hcg, et cetera. Never in a million years would I suggest anyone else do that in their 20s or 30s unless they have a serious issue with peptides. There's the risk of where you're getting it from, purity. But there's also the risk that if you're augmenting growth hormone in your teens, your 20s, you can really mess up your hypothalamic, pituitary, body axis, all the organs of your body in major ways. You shut down fertility. If you come off these things, you may revert to a state of, know, a depression, et cetera. I just think the whole looks maxing phenomenon is really, really dangerous and foolish, especially in people younger than 40. Right. It's just. Well, especially because there's a way to looks max without hitting your face with a hammer. Sleep, diet, exercise, you know, taking 99%. Of the way there also, see, you need to evaluate kind of where you are at the very end of puberty. Puberty is a very protracted thing. You know, I hit puberty when I was 14. I didn't shave till I was 20. I swear my head and face changed shape over time. You got to let your people develop over a long period of time. If you introduce exogenous hormones or you start blunting estrogen, or you start. Because guys will say, oh, they have too much estrogen or something, where they start taking peptides. I mean, you can really throw off the trajectory of your physiology. And then you're the person in your 40s and 50s often who looks much older. This is the thing that people don't realize, that there's always a dynamic tension between the things that give you vitality and the things that extend your life. If you take growth hormone, you'll feel more vital, you'll gain muscle more easily, recover from injury more easily. You'll lose visceral and body fat. Guess what? You'll also age more quickly. The reason bigger dogs die earlier than smaller dogs is they have higher dosing of growth hormone and IGF1, it's well established. So you get vitality, but you lose time with testosterone. You have to ask yourself, what are you gaining? What are you losing? If you can go from, you know, having no energy whatsoever to the ability to work and exercise, increase libido, et cetera, well, then you're probably gaining years if you're doing those things. But I'm very concerned about people just, you know, trying to get a, whatever an angle, jawline, you know, abs, etc. I mean, it's, it's because of phones, right? And people are taking photos of themselves. I mean, I'm old school, so I feel like if you're a guy taking pictures of your abs and posting it online, like, like you need to invest the money in a, in a, in a psychologist. Not in its peptide, but that's just, you know, that's a, that's a inspirational thing, right? I think I'm more impressed by what people can do with their physicality. Trying to hit it, some numbers, some lifts, some running, some hiking, some rucking. But this overemphasis on appearance on social media, I think is going to cause a lot of destruction for people that try and chase that.
Cans. Because a lot of people worry about that stuff. Yeah, smart. Nobody wants the credit cards worth of microplastics in their brains, testicle and ovaries. And it's free of all that. And it's awesome. I have very high caffeine tolerance, so I drink, no joke, like four to six of them a day. But most people do just fine with one or two. Right? I'm right with you. I don't know. It's crazy. So. So we have like such a regimented schedule that my caffeine intake during the week as I wake up, I don't follow your protocol around waiting. I get right into the yerba mate. I actually have ab tested it. I notice, I personally notice no difference whether I get started. You have one in the car before. The gym, one in the car on the way to the gym. Caffeine before the gym is such a hack. And I don't do it. And I need to get back into it. I don't know. Sometimes it's tough. How underrated is caffeine as a performance enhancing drug in the gym? I feel like that's. It's good. Well, look, if you have anxiety issues, you should be careful with caffeine. But if you don't, caffeine's great. It's definitely a performance enhancer. So much so that the people that regulate this stuff in sport set an upper limit on the milligrams of caffeine that you can ingest. But I cut off the caffeine intake at about 2pm but listen, I also drink caffeine first thing in the morning if I'm going to work out in the first two hours of the day. And that's about three, four days a week I do that. Other times I wait a little while. So it's really an option. But I love yerba. I also drink coffee. I'll have a couple double espresso. And I love it. I mean, but like you guys, I'm. Get up, hydrate, electrolytes, caffeine, family, work, work, work, work out. Work, work, work. And then by 8 o' clock or 9 o', clock, if you cut the caffeine out earlier, you're going to crash on a steep cliff. And it feels great because you fall asleep easily. Yeah. Yeah. How's the. I always. I always stop at. I always stop basically when the show ends, that's when I'm having my last caffeine for the day. I sleep amazing and then get it started again. Yeah. The challenge is on the weekend because in the week our. Our schedule is so regimented, and then on the weekend, it's a little more.
Sleep, I feel great. So I don't need Pinealin. But the peptide, that's going to change everything. And this is more up your guys alley because this gets right into the business sphere is Lilly has a patent. Eli Lilly has a patent on a peptide called retatrutide. Retatrutide is sometimes referred to as GLP3. It's a triple agonist of the GLP1 which we're all familiar with. Glucagon and something called gipsy. I believe if I'm wrong, someone will correct me. Of course the interesting thing here is that In a phase three clinical trial in humans, it caused up to 1/3 loss of body weight. So a loss of 1/3 of body weight in about six months time and it seems like there's some degree of muscle sparing. It works phenomenally well for weight loss. The bodybuilding community has been onto this for a long time, right? Bodybuilders always get there first. Then what happens is in Florida and the United States, doctors who work out in gyms with people who know how to gain muscle and lose fat quickly start experimenting. Then it goes into their high level clients. Then it shows up in Hollywood. Everyone lies or avoids answering the question of how they got so jacked. They talk about eating chicken breasts and they're actually taking growth hormone incipientate and Windstrol and retrutotide. Retatrutide, excuse me. And then everyone hears about it and they start whatever looks maxing it and then it's a big giant mess out there. Here's the deal. We are looking at a potential change in the laws around peptides such that buying peptides would become illegal. I actually think this is a terrible idea. But the motivation behind this is largely because Lilly owns the patent. People are already injecting retatrutide. They can buy it out there. They're taking it maybe a third of the dose that's recommended in the trial. And they are seeing phenomenal results at fat loss. Not a week goes by where I don't get 100 questions about ready to tie to my phone, my personal phone, let alone email and et cetera. Wow. So the reason why peptides might soon become illegal to purchase through even compounding pharmacies, let alone gray market, is because Lilly would like to protect the domain over that patent. This is going to be a trillion dollar drug. Trillion dollar. But people are already taking it. I've never tried it, but people I know who have taken it said it works phenomenally well at a fraction of the dose. So today I looked what are some benefits that outside of weight loss are. There secondary Reduced alcohol appetite? Reduce impulsivity perhaps. Remember that the receptors for these things are all over the brain and body and the other GLP agonists have been looked at for alcohol use disorder, for binge eating disorder, and for a lot of behavioral and impulse control disorders because a lot of the receptors are rooted in the hypothalamus which controls a lot of impulsivity type behaviors and anxiety related behaviors. So my stance on things is do as you wish but know what you're doing, but with the important caveat that if you are an adult and your body is fully formed, you are in a completely different landscape than if you're 14, 18, 20. I worry very much. We're hearing more and more about young people, especially women in the past, but now also young guys who are thinking oh they've got to take TRT. That's crazy. I've talked about the fact that at 45, I'm 50 now 45 years old, I started taking a micro dose.
Great, so I don't need Pinealin, but the peptide, that's going to change everything. And this is more up your guys alley because this gets right into the business sphere is Lilly has a patent, Eli Lilly has a patent on a peptide called retatrutide. Retatrutide is sometimes referred to as GLP3. It's a triple agonist of the GLP1 which we're all familiar with. Glucagon and something called GIP. I believe if I'm wrong someone will correct me. Of course the interesting thing here is that in a phase three clinical trial in humans it caused up to 1/3 loss of body weight. So a loss of 1/3 of body weight in about six months time and it seems like there's some degree of muscle sparing. It works phenomenally well for weight loss. The bodybuilding community has been onto this for a long time, right? Bodybuilders always get there first. Then what happens is in Florida and the United States, doctors who work out in gyms with people who know how to gain muscle and lose fat quickly start experimenting. Then it goes into their high level clients. Then it shows up in Hollywood. Everyone lies or avoids answering the question of how they got so jacked. They talk about eating chicken breasts and they're actually taking growth hormone incipientate and Winstrol and retrutotide. Retatrutide, excuse me. And then everyone hears about it and they start whatever looks maxing it and then it's a big giant mess out there. Here's the deal. We are looking at a potential change in the laws around peptides such that buying peptides would become illegal. I actually think this is a terrible idea. But the motivation behind this is largely because Lilly owns the patent. People are already injecting retatruti. They can buy it out there. They're taking it maybe a third of the dose that's recommended in the trial. And they are seeing phenomenal results at fat loss. Not a week goes by where I don't get 100 questions about ready to tie to my phone, my personal phone, let alone email and et cetera. Wow. So the reason why peptides might soon become illegal to purchase through even compounding pharmacies, let alone gray market, is because Lilly would like to protect the domain over that patent. This is going to be a trillion dollar drug. Trillion dollar. But people are already taking it. I've never tried it, but people I know who have taken it said it works phenomenally well at a fraction of the dose. So today I looked at what are some benefits that outside of weight loss, are there secondary Reduced alcohol appetite? Reduce impulsivity, Perhaps? Remember that the receptors for these things are all over the brain and body. And the other GLP agonists have been looked at for alcohol use disorder, for binge eating disorder, and for a lot of behavioral and impulse control disorders, because a lot of the receptors are rooted in the hypothalamus, which controls a lot of impulsivity type behaviors and anxiety related behaviors. So my stance on things is do as you wish, but know what you're doing, but with the important caveat that if you are an adult and your body is fully formed, you are in a completely different landscape than if you're 14, 18, 20. I worry very much. We're hearing more and more about young people, especially women. In the past.
Raise. I'm very happy to say. So we raised a $25 million seed. Seed. Not bad. There we go. There we go. That's what. What's after a mango seed? What's bigger than a mango seed? Cuz I think of a mango seed as like 8. This is like a watermelon. Yeah, watermelon. No, watermelon has small seeds. Watermelon, big fruit, small seeds, doesn't have a lot of. Mango is the biggest seed. It's just the end of the road after that you just go. Just go. Giant AI seed round. Well, congratulations and thank you so much for coming on the show and breaking it down for us. Yeah, come back like, as you guys have and things like that. Come back. You don't need to have fundraising news to come on and talk about biological computing. You guys come to the lab. Yeah, that'd be great. San Francisco and Mission Bay. You guys are always welcome to come. Amazing. See some brains. Thank you so much. We'll see you soon. Have a good rest of your day. Let me tell you about graphite. It's code review for the age of AI. Graphite helps teams on GitHub ship higher quality software. Software faster. And without further ado, Andrew Huberman is the founder of Huberman Lab. He's here in the TVP and ultradome. Welcome to the show. Here we are. Cheers, guys. Cheers. In a can. Can you hear me? Yes, we can hear you loud and clear. Give us the latest on mate. Yerba mate. Yeah. Zero sugar cold brew, Yerba mate. I'm half Argentine, so I've been drinking mate since I was a kid. Okay? It's got caffeine and it's a super smooth arc of caffeine. That's why I love it. Yeah. But the zero sugar cold brew, yeah, we made five different flavors. It's organic bpa, bps, Pfast free cans. Because a lot of people worry about that stuff. Yeah, smart. Nobody wants the credit card's worth of microplastics in their brains, testicle and ovaries. And it's free of all that. And it's awesome. I have very high caffeine tolerance, so I drink, no joke, like four to six of them a day. But most people do just fine with one or two. Right? I'm right with you. I don't know. It's crazy. So we have like such a regimented schedule that my caffeine intake during the week as I wake up, I don't follow your protocol around waiting. I get right into the yerba mate. I actually have AB tested it. I notice, I personally notice no difference whether I get started. So you have one in the car before the gym? I have one in the car on the way to the gym. Caffeine before the gym is such a hack and I don't do it and I need to get back into it. I don't know, sometimes it's tough. How underrated is caffeine? Caffeine as a performance enhancing drug in the gym, I feel like that's good. Well, look, if you have anxiety issues, you should be careful with caffeine, but if you don't, caffeine's great. It's definitely a performance enhancer. So much so that the people that regulate this stuff in sport set an upper limit on the milligrams of caffeine that you can ingest. But I cut off the caffeine intake at about 2pm but listen, I also drink caffeine first thing in the morning if I'm going to work out in the first two hours of the day. Sure. And that's about three, four days a week. I do that. Other times I, you know, I wait a little while. So it's really an option. But I love yerba. I also drink coffee. I'll have a couple double espresso and I love it. I mean, but like you guys, I'm get up, hydrate, electrolytes, caffeine, family, work, work, work, work, out. Work, work, work. And then by 8 o' clock or 9 o', clock, if you cut the caffeine out earlier, you're going to crash on a steep cliff and it feels great because you fall asleep easily. Yeah, yeah. I always, I always stop it. I always stop basically when the show ends. That's when I'm having my last caffeine for the day. I sleep amazing and then get it started again. Yeah, the challenges on the weekend, because in the week our, our schedule is so regimented and then on the weekend it's a little more flexible and I'll start feeling if I haven't had my fourth yerba, by the way, my fridge. At home is filled with Mata because if I don't, I'm like, not a good dad. I mean, in South America, you'll see people drinking yerba after meals because it helps with digestion. It's a mild appetite suppressant. So if you like, I like to work out fasted. It's not going to kill your appetite, which is good because we still need to eat. Everyone's like trying to eat less these days, it seems. But you still need to get the nutrients and then it's high in antioxidants. It's got a lot of positive benefits. And it's not necessarily an alternative to coffee. You could do both. But it's not an energy drink, quote unquote, in the sense it, it doesn't have alpha gpc, taurine, all those things that a lot of energy drinks have. Not to knock on those things, but I think Yerba coffee. Yeah. The challenge is making traditional energy drinks a habit. You're supplementing a bunch of things that you don't necessarily. You have to understand you're signing yourself up to be constantly dosing supplements that a lot of people just aren't fully aware of because they, they just look at it. They're looking, how much caffeine does this have? And not really paying attention to the other stuff. How is the business? Oh, sorry. No, go ahead. I was just curious about the state of the business distribution. I mean, you have a massive audience, so the logical place to start is direct to consumer. But the final boss of almost every consumer product is retail. How are you thinking about the rollout of the product? Yeah, it's going great. I mean, we partnered with Mattina, so I'm a partial owner with Scicom. You guys know Rob and the rest of the guys at SciCom. Andrew Wilkinson from Tin. Oh, yeah. And we are available online through Matina, through Amazon. We launched in Whole Foods in Costco Canada and in Sprouts markets just recently. And pretty soon it will likely be everywhere you look. So. And people love it. You know, I'm very happy when people say they love it. It's delicious. You know, 90% of the world's adults drink caffeine every single day. It's the most popular drug in the world. And most people need it to function pretty, pretty well. But recent studies showed they looked at coffee, but a couple of cups of caffeinate coffee per day seems like it can offset some of the dementia risk. Now there, I mean, with a study like that, there are a bunch of issues. It's not necessarily causal. Right. People drinking caffeine probably working more, focusing more, more cognitively engaged, et cetera, et cetera. But as long as it doesn't send you into a, a spiral of anxiety, you know, caffeine is quite good for you. That's very clear, sort of random. But do you have any insight into what different groups of Olympic athletes are doing? When I've seen some, I've heard some stories like there's such a range with these athletes where you Might have, like, an Olympic snowboarder who's like, you know, hardly sleeping and just, like, having some energy drinks and heading out there. And then you have, like, the guy that's doing, like, curling is, like, you know, the most regimented or whatever. Obviously, everybody's different. But what do you think the. What do you think the best athletes in the world are doing this Olympics? Like, what's cutting edge that maybe normal people aren't thinking about? Yeah. So, I mean, this also showed up in the NFL a little while ago, but people are taking vasodilators. You know, Viagra and tadalafil, commonly goes by Cialis. You know, tadalafil is a vasodilator, lowers blood pressure, and people know of it as Cialis for erectile dysfunction. Right. But it was originally developed as a drug to improve prostate health. Because when you vasodilate, when you dilate the vasculature, you get more perfusion of the prostate, and you need perfusion of the prostate. Avoid infections, but other things as well. So the basic takeaway is that Most every male 40 and older should probably be taking somewhere between 2.5 and 5 milligrams of tadalafil, not necessarily for erectile function, although it will augment that as well, but to lower blood pressure and to improve vasodilation for the brain, for the prostate. I'm not saying this as a biohacker or a podcaster. We had our head of male sexual health from Stanford. His name is Mike eisenberg. He's an MD, PhD. He is best in class in terms of male sexual health, endocrinology, et cetera. That's his recommendation. And it's one that most every male, maybe 35, but at least 40 and older, should take just as a preventative, you know, strokes. So you don't think that'll. People are taking it. Athletes are taking it as effectively lower performance. To lower anxiety, pre game to, because it lowers your blood pressure a little bit. They think it might be a performance enhancer by delivering more blood to the muscles. You know, you have to look at what's on the band list, and there's obviously lots of things on the banned list. And then they're gonna be the things that people are gonna use because they're not on the banned list, and they'll be banned the next Olympics. That's often how it goes. So I pay a lot of attention to this over the years. If you looked in the 90s, you saw things like bromocriptine, apomorphine Things that people who know those names will augment. Acetylcholine, dopamine in order to improve fast transmission of neurons and alertness and focus for getting quickest out the blocks and sprinting, for instance. Those drugs are now banned. Okay, you'll see in sports where staying calm is an advantage. Any shooting sport, for instance, most of the banned drugs are things that lower heart rate. Imagine skiing up to a target, picking up your gun and shooting. The less you're shaking, the better. So there's a bunch of banned drugs, and then there are all the things that people will take to lower their blood pressure. And some of those are not banned. And this is kind of how the cycle goes. We heard about the skiers injecting their penises in order to expand their bulge size. I guess it were in order to get a little more air resistance in order to perhaps capture a little more airtime. That was. I hit the press mostly because it's kind of. It's kind of humorous when we think about it. That was real. That was real. You're going to see this. You're going to see this. You're going to see peptides like BPC157 I believe is banned. But that's a naturally occurring gut peptide. Very hard to test for because you have tons of it circulating. And the synthetic versions may or may not differ from that version as much. So much that you can detect it. Yeah. Interesting. You have a question about peptides broadly? Yeah, I would love like an update. Since we last talked, probably tens of millions of Americans have jumped into the fray, or you've taken over San Francisco. Chinese peptides is like a whole meme in tech. And I think everyone's wondering, Faustian bargain, at what level should they be experimenting with these things? What type of research they should be doing? What is the current thinking around peptides broadly? Okay, I'll hit the key bullet points here for the novices and for the aficionados. So a peptide is a short chain of amino acids. So insulin is a peptide. So when people say peptides, they're generally referring to things that people take by injection or orally in order to augment some effect, healing, growth hormone release, et cetera. Just as when we hear the word steroids, I mean, estrogen's a steroid hormone. But when we hear about steroids, we're typically thinking about androgenic steroids, right? Testosterone, et cetera. Okay, so when it comes to peptides, some are FDA approved, right. Some are made by drug companies, have passed through their patent, many of the so called growth hormone secretagogues, Tessamorelin, ipamorelin, these are things that cause the pituitary to release more growth hormone. These have been tested, FDA approved. Most people are not getting them from drug companies. They're getting them from either compounding pharmacies, which are our lower cost alternative, that there isn't as much stringency in terms of purity. So they varies by compounding pharmacy or from what we call gray or black market sources. So when you say Chinese peptides, what you're talking about is you can go online and buy peptides that are listed or labeled as for research purposes only. And that's what a lot of people are injecting. And that is a concern. And I, you know, I'm not saying this because of my relationship to Stanford or anything like that, but I'll just say I do not think anyone should inject peptides that are labeled as for research purposes only. Because even if it says 99% purity, the 1% is likely to be something called LPS, lipid polysaccharide, which can cause inflammation. It's not a good thing to be injecting. Maybe one injection doesn't do anything, but when you're injecting every day for five days, a week and for a month, you can start running into some issues, autoimmune effects and so on. That said, let's just acknowledge what people are doing. And there's some peptides that have very impressive results for which there's essentially no human, good human data, lots of animal data and lots of anecdote data out there. For instance, people will claim, although there's no really good clinical trial, that BPC157, which is a synthetic version of a gut peptide, can accelerate their wound healing. What's the problem? We don't have a control experiment. It acts systemically. So I can't inject it in one elbow, not the other. If I have two elbow injuries and say, okay, it worked better for this one, not the other. And people claim it could be placebo, but people claim that it helps them. Study where they break both of your arms. But the issue is that it goes through your whole body. Yeah, yeah, you know, and it increases vascular growth, it increases nerve growth, it increases cartilage regrowth. From the animal studies, we know that. So the logical backbone is there. People are using it like crazy. The lethal dose is very, very high. I don't even know if anyone's achieved a lethal dose. The one study that was done in humans looked at, believe it or Not BPC enemas at very, very high doses. Gut like a colitis issue. I believe it was. Listen, I think you have to just decide what your margin for risk is. The other one that's very interesting that not a lot of people are talking about is Pinealin, which I've tried it, I don't take it any longer. I tried it for a little while and it doubled my REM sleep. I was getting close to three hours of REM sleep per night. It's thought to increase regeneration or the health of pinealocytes in the pineal which make melatonin and so on and so forth. But the big one, the peptides, that's. Going to change everything. I think I tried that. The one you just mentioned last week. I was hanging out with David Senra and a friend of ours had it and I think it was in a capsule form. I expected it not to work very well. Friend said it works fine. I tried it. No effect on my data. Is that how do you think about different form factors? Injectable only and on an empty stomach, not having, meaning not having eaten in the previous two hours, 30 minutes before. Because that's an issue. That's an issue because it's a gray market right now. People will just be like, yeah, I'll sell you a peptide in this capsule. Technically it's, it's what I'm saying it is. But I'm giving you it in a form factor that doesn't actually work. And so it's all placebo. But I just looked at the data and I was like, I tried this two nights in a row, it had zero effect. And I don't think a lot of. People, I doubt it was Pineal and it might have. And sometimes they'll throw some melatonin in there. So you feel, quote unquote an effect if for some people you got to get it from a compounding pharmacy or a reliable source. I'm not suggesting people do it. I actually stopped taking it because, and this is not a promotional, but I take agz which is their sleep formula. I help design it. My sleep on AGZ is amazing. Amazing. I'm getting two and a half hours of REM sleep per night. I get tons of deep sleep. I feel great. So I don't need Pinealin. But the peptide, that's going to change everything. And this is more up your guys alley because this gets right into the business sphere is Lilly has a patent, Eli Lilly has a patent on a peptide called retatrutide. Retatrutide is sometimes referred to as GLP3. It's a triple agonist of the GLP1 which we're all familiar with. Glucagon and something called GIP. I believe if I'm wrong someone will correct me. Of course the interesting thing here is that in a phase 3 clinical trial in humans, it caused up to one third loss of body weight. So a loss of 1/3 of body weight in about 6 months time it seems like there's some degree of muscle sparing. It works phenomenally well for weight loss. The bodybuilding community has been onto this for a long time. Bodybuilders always get there first. Then what happens is in Florida and the United States, doctors who work out in gyms with people who know how to gain muscle and lose fat quickly start experimenting. Then it goes into their high level clients. Then it shows up in Hollywood. Everyone lies or avoids answering the question of how they got so jacked. They talk about eating chicken breasts and they're actually taking growth hormone incipientate and Winstrol and retrudotide retatrutide. Excuse me. And then, and then everyone hears about it and they start, you know, whatever looks maxing it and then it's a big giant mess out there. Here's the deal. We are looking at a potential change in the laws around peptides such that buying peptides would become illegal. I actually think this is a terrible idea. But the motivation behind this is largely because Lilly owns the patent. People are already injecting retatrutide. They can buy it out there, they're taking it maybe a third of the dose that's recommended in the trial. And they are seeing phenomenal results at fat loss. Not a week goes by where I don't get 100 questions about REDI Truth. It might phone my personal phone, let alone email and et cetera. Wow. So the reason why peptides might soon become illegal to purchase through even compounding pharmacies, let alone gray market, is because Lilly would like to protect the domain over that patent. This is going to be a trillion dollar drug. Trillion dollar. But people are already taking it. I've never tried it, but people I know who have taken it said it works phenomenally well at a fraction of the dose. So today I looked at what are some benefits that outside of weight loss. Are there Secondary reduced alcohol appetite, reduce impulsivity perhaps. Remember that the receptors for these things are all over the brain and body. And the other GLP agonists have been looked at for alcohol use disorder, for binge eating disorder and for A lot of behavioral and impulse control disorders because a lot of the receptors are rooted in the hypothalamus, which controls a lot of impulsivity type behaviors and anxiety related behaviors. So, you know, my stance on things is, you know, do as you wish, but know what you're doing. But with the important caveat that if you are an adult and your body is fully formed, you are in a completely different landscape than if you're 14, 18, 20. You know, I worry very much. We're hearing more and more about young people, especially women in the past, but now also young guys who are thinking, oh, you know, they've got to take trt. That's crazy. You know, I've talked about the fact that at 45, I'm 50 now, 45 years old, I started taking a microdose of cypionate. Microdose, but micro. So I maintain fertility. I've checked that. I take hcg, et cetera. Never in a million years would I suggest anyone else do that in their 20s or 30s unless they have a serious issue with peptides. There's the risk of where you're getting it from. Purity, right? But there's also the risk that if you're augmenting growth hormone in your teens, your 20s, you can really mess up your hypothalamic, pituitary, body axis, all the organs of your body in major ways, you know, shut down fertility. You get, if you come off these things, you, you may revert to a state of, you know, a depression, et cetera. I just think the whole looks maxing phenomenon is really, really dangerous and foolish, especially in people younger than 40. Right. It's just, well, especially because there's a way to look smacks without hitting your face with a hammer. Sleep, diet, exercise, you know, taking get. You 99% of the way there. Also, see, you need to evaluate kind of where you are at the very end of puberty. Puberty is a very protracted thing. You know, I hit puberty when I was 14, I didn't shave till I was 20. I swear my head and face changed shape over time. You got to let your people develop over a long period of time. If you introduce exogenous hormones or you start blunting estrogen, or you start, you know, because guys will say, oh, they have too much estrogen or something, where they start taking peptides. I mean, you can really throw off the trajectory of your physiology. And then you're the person in your 40s and 50s often who looks much older. This is the thing that people don't realize that there's always a dynamic tension between the things that give you vitality and the things that extend your life. For instance, if you take growth hormone, you'll feel more vital, you'll gain muscle more easily, recover from injury more easily, you'll lose visceral and body fat. Guess what? You'll also age more quickly. The reason bigger dogs die earlier than smaller dogs is they have higher dosing of growth hormone and IGF1. It's well established. So you get vitality, but you lose time with testosterone. You have to ask yourself, what are you gaining? What are you losing? If you can go from having no energy whatsoever to the ability to work and exercise, increase libido, et cetera, well, then you're probably gaining years if you're doing those things. But I'm very concerned about people just trying to get whatever an angle, jawline, abs, et cetera. It's, it's because of phones, right? Of people taking photos themselves. I mean, I'm old school, so I feel like if you're a guy taking pictures of your abs and posting it online, like, like you need to invest the money in a, in a, in a psychologist, not in a peptide. But that's just it, you know, that's a, that's a generational thing, right? I think I'm more impressed by what people can do with their physicality, trying to hit it, some numbers, some lifts, some running, some hiking, some rucking and, and then. But this overemphasis on appearance on social media, I think is going to cause a lot of destruction for people that try and chase that. Do you get questions from parents who have teenagers and they're considering giving their teenagers HGH all the time? So people who have kids that are much shorter than their peers nowadays, often, I'm not suggesting doing this will delay puberty in their kids. They'll sometimes give them growth hormone. We know that some of the drugs, the prescription drugs that help with ADHD, can blunt growth at high dosages. There's actually a very interesting drug that went through phase three or is at the end of phase three now, which was designed, excuse me, designed for excessive daytime sleepiness, called Sunosi, which is kind of a dirtier hit of the dopamine and epinephrine and a little bit serotonin receptors that is promising for adhd. That's a non amphetamine ADHD drug. That's very interesting. That might be a good alternative to some of the Adderall, Vyvanse, et cetera. Of course, you need a Doctor's prescription for these things, I'll just throw out a name. I have no formal affiliation to them, but there's a YouTube channel, a guy, we had him on the podcast, Dr. John Cruz K R U S E who has covered every aspect of adult and child adhd, from behavioral tools to the different drugs, the amphetamine based drugs, Sunosi and all of those Modafinil. Very, very high information content, short videos, 10 to 15 minutes. Nothing like mine, you know, mine will cure insomnia. So I send parents there and look, I can say, what are you doing giving your kid growth hormone? But like, I don't know, I was never the tallest in my class, I was never the shortest. I'm, you know, six one if I stand up straight, you know, five' eleven if I slouch. And so I do understand why people feel like they need to do this for their kids based on what you hear out there. But when you start playing at home, endocrinologist, and now it's very easy to find a physician that'll work with you on these things. You are, you're playing, you know, you're playing a dice game and you're playing it. So you have to think real carefully about when, when and if to do these things. But ultimately, you know, parents decide and kids decide. Switching gears. I want to talk about cannabis. I was about to ask. Yeah. Are you guys fans? Be honest. No, I'm not a fan. No. Yeah, me either. It used to be, I mean, I grew up in, I grew up in Northern California, so it was always. It's funny, wine country is like cannabis country, you know, it's less visible than, you know, the vineyards and things like that. It used to be expensive, difficult to obtain, laced with oregano. Now it's like industrialized, available at the push of a button. And I mean, the New York Times is writing that. You see these charts, like the number of hospitalizations, that was never a thing in the 90s that I remember. And it feels like we're on the cusp of, of really just rediscussing this as a society. On, are we in an epidemic? Do we need to have a more national conversation? But what are you seeing in the research and in your world about how big the problem is? Yeah, well, as a personal stance, I'm largely for legal but regulated that just as my personal stance, I wanna just throw that out. That's just me personally. I've hosted two guests, one clinician, one scientist about this. And I did a solo episode. I did the solo episode in addition to making some small errors in there about receptor affinities and things like that, I made a statement which was based on the literature I was seeing, which is that there is a population of people, especially young males, who have a predisposition to schizophrenia or bipolar, meaning they have a first relative with those conditions that are at very high risk for cannabis induced psychosis, some of which doesn't reverse, which is really scary. I got accused of misinformation by traditional media. Not, you know, not like being off misinformation. And I'm going to keep my hands under the table because my response to that I think they can understand. Yeah, so misinformation of American Medical. Yeah, I witnessed and at this point everyone has the anecdote there too kid, where. Yeah, well now the pendulum is swung back and those same publications are saying it can cause psychosis. Okay, look, so there's more data now I get it right in the media game as a whole discussion in to itself. So I had one guest come on, very thoughtful guest researcher from Canada who explained that the psychosis is often caused by an over ingestion of too much thc. And in his words, just to be fair to him, because he's a serious researcher, serious scientist, said that when people smoke, so if they inhale it by vape or smoking, they tend to hit a plane of high that's not excessive and the risk for psychotic episode is lower. Then the clinician I brought on said that he's not observing that he's a clinician. Keith Humphrey, he's from Stanford, he's not observing that he's an expert in addiction of all kinds. And so what we do know for sure is that THC concentrations are very high. It's very easy to over ingest through an edible versus through inhalation. Look, I think that the issue is how often and how much and on what genetic background is somebody doing this. Now the problem is you don't want to be part of the experiment. You don't want to be the person that discovers that you have a predisposition to psychosis by smoking high THC weed. We see the same thing with Kratom. So with Kratom you've got Kratom products that people say, oh, you know, Kratom helped them get off opioids. And I don't deny that. Right. You've got activist groups that are pro Kratom. You also have people who will say they took so called Kratom products which are isolates of the molecule. This is what we Tend to do in this country. We find an interesting plant that has some psychoactive properties and then, I don't know, maybe pull the nicotine out of tobacco, concentrate it. Next thing you know, they're making money and you're putting in, you know, five pouches a day. They'll take Kratom, the plant which is chewed, the leaves are chewed. People say, oh, it's kind of a balance between alertness and calm. Great, they'll isolate Kratom, then they'll do Kratom isolates. And now you're getting people who are having opioid, like addiction to Kratom isolates to synthetics. Likewise with thc, you had a balance between THC and CBD in the plant, different strains, et cetera, et cetera. It was a kind of a community for a long time. This has, you know, it even has religious uses, et cetera, and cultural, you know, relationships. And then all of a sudden it's like, no, we've got really high THC concentrates that you can buy at the convenience store. And then people with a predisposition are having psychotic episodes. Here are a couple things. I'll say one thing facetious and then a couple things serious. One, I really love to compete with people who like cannabis because unless they're a martial artist or a creative, like a musician, you're gonna blast past them. So, you know, it's kind of like recommending great Netflix series to your competitors, right? Yeah. Or Remote Work, I recommend. You're gonna win. Okay, now that's the facetious side. The serious side is, you know, couple guys or friends, gals, two getting together and smoking some weed. And one person's like, oh, this really calms my anxiety. Makes. Makes them feel as if they can engaged socially. And the next thing you know, they're losing motivation for a bunch of other things layered on top of social media. The challenges of life as they always existed, but also nowadays. And the next thing you know, you've got somebody with some serious mental health issues and a full blown addiction. I do know that my colleagues that work on addiction, Dr. Anna Lemke, who's an MD, who wrote dopamine Nation, Keith Humphries at Stanford, they'll tell you that many, many more people are coming to them of all ages saying they struggle with cannabis. I will also say that you're not gonna get REM sleep sleep if you are ingesting cannabis, certainly within a few hours of sleep. Anyone that quits cannabis will tell you that their REM sleep, their dreams, just comes Back like crazy for many months, if not years. And you need REM sleep to offload the emotional load of prior day experiences. So I get it. And then the last thing is that there's always the comparison to alcohol. Actually did a post about this on X, but it's crazy, right? I mean, I've talked about alcohol before. Zero is better than any two per week. You're probably fine. If you're going to drink more, do more things for it to support your lifestyle. I'm not a teetotaler. Do as you want, but know what you're doing. But people always say it's better than alcohol, as if you had to pick one. And maybe you do. Maybe in order to socialize, people feel like they have to pick one. I don't know. I've always been able to say whatever the heck is on my mind without any alcohol or drugs. So you don't want to be around me if I were drunk? Because I'll tell everyone everything. But no, I do it anyway. And I think it's just an issue of. I get it. In your teens and twenties, late teens and twenties, college, thirties, when you go to a bar, you don't want to sit around and necessarily sober. I get it. So what are you going to do? You're going to have a couple drinks or weed, which one is better? It really depends on who you are. And the comparison is just kind of a fool's errand. You're never going to solve what's better. But there are many, many more people smoking or ingesting high THC cannabis. And you have examples of people who are extremely successful, extremely ambitious who use cannabis. But those people probably need it to not go over the peak of anxiety from their ambition. They're using it to stay in a healthy zone. Whereas people that have more apathy, they're less motivated, they should stay away from cannabis, in my opinion, if they want to make something of their life. I completely agree. That's great. That episode. Yeah. Hard to fit into a post on that. Yeah. So. So there's been a lot of studies on the impact of social media on people's mental health. Right. Young people, teenagers. What about. And then right now, one of the most popular words in the world is or phrases. Brain rot. Right. Are there any large scale studies being done on the impact of consuming an hour or two hours a day of short form video? Like what are you tracking? Because if you just look at the data YouTube has, I forget the exact number, but the average person in the world is watching like A meaningful amount of shorts every day. So some people are watching hundreds and hundreds, others are watching zero or maybe a few, but there's a range. Yeah. Well, I'll just offer a tool that I think is very useful. I mean, I don't have problems with behavioral restraint, but I. But I do have a lockbox for my social media phone. So I took my. An old phone, I put social media on that phone so that if people text me social media links, I can't open them. It also means that when I take out that phone, I'm posting or commenting or doing that. And I keep it in this lockbox, which is like a supermax prison you can't even code out of. It has a no code out setting. And I'll leave it in there about 20 plus hours a day. And it's just great. It's just great. I mean, your productivity will go through the roof. I mean, it's getting very easy to blow past your peers now just by avoiding being on social media a little bit more. I mean, David Goggins said this. It's like it's easier than ever now to be successful if you just don't do certain things. Whereas in the past it was like, what do I have to do to be successful? Like, the shortest productivity self help book will be, you know, lock your social media phone in a box for 23 hours a day. And then I do think that. So I'm not aware of any studies looking at one to two hours per day. And I do think that when you approach social media or you're getting online, I think it's important to realize that the brain has an absolutely insatiable appetite for short form video, but its appetite for long form audio is also very high. This is why podcasts continue to grow in their reach. People don't want to hear audio turning over quickly unless there's video associated with it. So I try to get on social media at least once a day, maybe half hour, 45 minutes at the most. But I'm posting and commenting. I think at the moment where you forget time and you're just like. And it's sucking you in is the time where it needs to go back in the lockbox. But listen, Joe, I listen to you guys. I listen to news on social media and I think that's the world we're in. I think that some people also can be on social media and experience some distance from it. Other people are more kind of pulled in emotionally to what's going on. It depends if you're a Creator and people are commenting about you or you're actively engaged in the conversations, or if you're simply an observer. But I think an hour and a half a day should be the upper limit for anyone that actually wants to accomplish something in life. And probably more like 45 minutes to an hour. Unless you're watching news. If you're learning, how do you know if you're learning? What we know from neuroplasticity studies is that that if you reflect on something the next day, you're likely to not forget it. It sounds sort of trivial, but most of learning is anti forgetting. In fact, there was a beautiful study done where they have people read a passage once, twice, three times or four times versus reading it just once and then self testing on it in their mind at some point later. And the self testing in your mind, what do I remember, what don't I remember? I forget that part extended the memory of what was in that passage out six months to a year in some cases. So the reflection on what you saw is the key. So if you think, okay, what did you see yesterday that was of interest, where you actually learned something of value, then you're actually learning from social media or a podcast. But if you're just getting inundated with sensory information, forget it. That's called entertainment. You're just numbing out or they're rage baiting you. And I mean between what happened, between the Minnesota stuff, right? Then the Epstein thing and then the next political whatever, the amygdala is just getting hammered. And we know when the amygdala is activated that you're getting many more bits of memory stored, but you're just getting the peak of that information. You're kind of getting a summary. So look, your brain, real estate is your most valuable real estate. What are you going to put in there? What are you learning? And so I would say take a walk and ask yourself, what did I learn on social media today or yesterday? And there's actually some learning to be had. Like I've reflected on what I've seen in this Epstein thing. There were a lot of scientists there, there were a lot of people that were that buried his offenses so that he could come out as this kind of like science finance liaison buries. I mean it was wild how this could happen right after a conviction. And so there's some consideration to be had. But you need to get away from the content in order to think about that and then return to it in a way that's more, I think, nuanced. And that can serve you as opposed to just getting rage baited into it all. Never get rage baited. What excites you about AI? Anything. Yeah, I'll tell you where I'm using AI. I've wrapped my book, I'm doing edits on it right now. And I didn't use AI to write my book. But what I think AI is great for is for designing little exams for yourself for exactly what I just described. So I will have. I like Claude, so I'll just ask Claude to test me on. Give me a 20 question multiple choice test on the microbiome as it relates to the solo episode that I did. Plus some recent work from my colleague Justin Sonnenberg, for instance, at Stanford, perhaps the best researcher on the human microbiome in the world. And Claude will give me questions and I'll go, oh, that's cool, I remember that. Wait, that's where my knowledge falls off. What percentage of the vagus nerve is motor descending? Okay. Those things are important to me. Maybe not you. And so I'm using it to consolidate information that I've learned prior that I might otherwise forget and update my knowledge. And then I'll go to the papers, make sure the papers are actually what's linked there. Because as we know, AI can hallucinate. I think that's fantastic. So it's a teacher. I'm using it to self test, which I know based on a lot of literature can help stamp down memories. So that's one way that I'm using it. I think I love the AI that's woven into eight sleep. That is now I'm no longer adjusting the temperatures. It's doing it for me. Love that. Awesome. I'm giving it my blood tests and it's helping me navigate that. I mean I had a blood lipid issue that was very slight, but I wanted to keep it in range and so I started taking nattokinase. I have no relationship to any company that sells it. Boom, right back into range. And I helped me understand what nattokinase, what sort of shifts can occur. I love Claude and I don't, you know, I mean I'd love to work with them, but I don't, I don't have any relationship to them now. So love, love, love what they're doing and I just think it's super exciting. I'm not afraid of AI but listen, I'm born and raised in Palo Alto, so like heretical to say you don't, you know, are excited about the most recent tech. Last question for me and we'll let you get out of here. Tell us about the fish behind you. Oh yeah. So those are my discus fish. They're freshwater discus. And next to me on either side it was octopus on this side and there'll be another octopus on that side. Very cool. Octopus died after two years. They lay eggs, they die. That's just what they do. It's very dramatic. Cannibalized her tentacles, everything. They're big drama. Big drama. Yeah, yeah. They remind me of some online influencers who are always trying to call attention to themselves, but in the end it self destruct. It self destructs. Relaxing to you, is there? Why fish and yeah. So I've long been a fan of aquaria since I was a kid. And it's just the goal of setting up an ecosystem that's really in balance and it's, it's made me very tranquil. I've always had them in my office, in my lab. And then some years ago, I discovered a guy named Takashi Amano who unfortunately passed away some years ago. But he developed this thing of aquascaping where it, it's really emphasizing the plants and the fish and the lighting. So we built these black box rooms. I'm living. So I moved into an art gallery. I converted a three story art gallery into a living space. I have a gym with fish tanks, octopuses, a loft upstairs. And then in my basement is a no phone, no electronics zone where I draw, do illustrations and I prepare for podcasts and I have it set up with these warm incandescent red lights. My girlfriend and I like to go down there and listen to music and just hang, like get totally away from the world. And I just love the feeling of kind of being underwater a little bit and it relaxes me. And I've got a bulldog puppy that was born a week ago and he's going to be here soon. More flora, more fauna is always bring. The gong for the bulldog. Gong for the bulldog. Bulldogs are the present name. Got a name yet? Yes. Drummer after the great Joe Strummer from the Clash. I went to the the to New York last weekend. My girlfriend. I went to go see meet the breeds, 140 purebred dogs. Everything from the little teacup ones to the bull mastiffs that look like Bert Kreischer and everything in between. And after we left, we just looked at each other and we're like mudded bulldog, which is what I had before. I love all the different breeds. They teach you a lot about nervous systems and temperaments and bullmastiff. Is the perfect dog for Bird. I think he's got a couple of them. But for me, it's always going to be the mudded bulldogs. I don't think I'll ever deviate. Very cool. Amazing. Thank you so much for taking. Great to see you. Great to catch up. Great to see you guys. Thanks. Congrats on the. On the Super Bowl. Yeah. I hope to see you in the Olympics. We will be. We are. We are. We are. We're going to be. Olympics. Amazing. And so Mata's logo will be in there, right? Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. Maybe. We got to get Matahina into the Olympics. I gotta talk to Rob. Yeah, I have an idea. A minute. But, Rob, the whole team's. The whole team has a look. The whole team has. Here we go. There we go. Love it. Yeah. Yeah. We opened the show. You're watching TVPN with these every day. Thank you so much. Yeah, thanks, guys. We'll see you soon. Take care. Goodbye. And with that, we do have to jump on the to Tokyo. So are there any posts? Any other news? Tyler, did we miss anything? Andrew Reed said, literally everyone's capitulated on the AI trade. There's definitely no bubble. Surely now is the perfect time to declare victory. Clock toad is growing 100% month over month. Wow. 2.5 billion run rate, 100% month over. Is that good? Yeah. There's also.
Come on, get up. You're surrounded by jungle. And hold your position. Strike 1. Strike 2. Activate. Go. The retriever. Trust. Market clearing order inbound five coded. I see multiple journalists on the horizon. Standby. You. Today is Thursday, February 12th. We are live from the TVP Ultra on the temple of technology, the fortress of finance, the capital of capital. Ramp.com baby. Time is money save both easy use corporate cards, bill pay accounting and a whole lot more all in one place. We have a great show for you today, folks. We're taking a little tour of the health world. We got Brian Johnson and Andrew Huberman on the show. Of course. We also have Matthew Zeitlin, June Park, David Risher from Lyft is coming in. Todd McKinnon from Okta. We have a number of other folks joining the lightning round. It should be a five fun show. But first I have to tell you what LINEAR is. Not only do they sponsor the lineup, but they are the system for modern software development. 70% of enterprise workspaces on LINEAR are using agents. So something big happened yesterday. There was a massive viral article. And do you know how big this something big is happening? How much that grew? It went big. I was getting texts about it. It has over 100,000 likes now. We were looking at. It was like 50 likes. How many views? I think it's over 100 million now. It's quickly becoming the most read thing in the world. I don't know. It's crazy. 75 million. 75 million views. Views. Okay. And 100. They're saying that only 200 people actually read it. But everyone has an opinion. Everyone has been. I had an opinion. I wrote a piece about it yesterday. And comparing saying AI is not like Covid. I kind of got one shot by the, by the COVID analogy, just from a mathematical perspective. Spent a lot of time talking about the difference between experiential growth and sigmoidal curves and logistics curves. But I enjoyed it. I enjoyed talking to the author on the show. And Will Menidis had a great rebuttal as well. Talking about, these are tool shaped. What are they? Tools. Tool shaped objects. Tool shaped objects. Just the idea of like getting your workflow set up. It can be a little bit of a nerd snipe sometimes. There's a whole bunch of news. But the best reaction for two, something big is happening. It's gotta be John Palmer. Something small is happening. I was reading this this morning, actually laughing out loud. So we'll read through it. John Palmer says, yeah, you were reading it to yourself. And then you just started belly laughing. Yes. And so then I started filming. Then I asked you reading. I was filming you. I sent that to John. I missed that to get his reaction. I was you reacting to his. Yeah. Before we read through this, let me tell you about Restream 1 livestream 30 plus destinations. If you want a multi stream go to restream.com so think back to 2014. A little over a decade ago, if you wanted a burrito, you had to get in your car and drive to the restaurant. You had to stand in line, you had to talk to a person. If someone told you that one day a stranger would bring you a burrito to your front door because you pressed a button on your phone, you would have said, that sounds dystopian. And also incredible. Then over the course of about three years, it just became normal. And this was before Chipotle started skimping out on the portions too. So it was really, really good. I think we're at that same inflection point right now. Except if instead of burritos, it's your entire job. I've spent the two weeks reading about AI and watching clips of people building things with it. I live in this world now. The future is being shaped by a remarkably small number of people. A few hundred researchers at a handful of companies. I'm not one of these people, says John Palmer. I work in crypto, but I am close enough to feel the ground shake. I follow several AI researchers on X and I also recently purchased a Mac Mini. I haven't set it up yet, but I think you can understand what I'm saying. I know this is real because it happened to other people first. Here's the thing nobody outside of tech understands yet. The people sounding the alarm aren't making predictions. They're telling you what already happened to them. I am relaying this information to you secondhand, with conviction. For years, AI had been improving steadily. I absorbed these improvements fine, because I wasn't really paying attention, to be honest. Then apparently in 2025, everything got much faster and then faster again. I know this because I watched a three hour podcast about it last Wednesday. The host was visibly shaken. I could tell because he wasn't even able to finish a single pint of Guinness. Taking shots Then, on February 5, two major AI labs released new models on the same day, and something clicked. Not for me personally. I was at a birthday dinner for my wife's co worker, but for the people who tried the models that day, it was apparently a huge deal. One guy said he Tells his AI what to build, walks away for a few hours, and comes back to find the work done. This will very likely be what my life is like as well. Once I set up my academy, AI will be doing things while I'm in the other room. That's potentially huge, huge, huge. Let me give you an example so you can understand what this looks like in practice. A guy on Twitter built an entire app just by describing it. The AI wrote the code, opened the app, tested the buttons, decided it didn't like the layout, fixed it, and only then said, it's ready. I'm going to do something. I'm going to do something like that with my Mac Mini. Some type of cool app or something. I'm still figuring it out, but I have all the hardware and I'm definitely going to optimize my setup with all types of skills and plugins. I'm not exaggerating. That's what my Tuesday could look like, potentially. But I tried AI and it wasn't that good. People would say this. They say this, I tried AI, it wasn't that good. Here's John Palmer's response. He says, I hear this constantly. I understand it because I also thought this. But the models today are apparently unrecognizable from what existed six months ago. Some of the people who are saying this have hundreds of thousands of followers. And make sure you're not on the free plan. You have to get on the paid plan. That's key. How fast is this actually moving? Let's answer that question. In 2022, AI couldn't do basic math. By 2023, it could pass the bar exam. By 2024, it could write working software. And by 2025, some of the best engineers in the world had handed over most of their coding work to AI. In February 2026, you can make AI send you a morning summary of the top posts on Reddit from your Mac Mini. Here we go. What should you actually do? I'm not writing this to scare you, says John Palmer. I'm writing this because the single biggest advantage you can have right now is being early. Early to understand it, early to buy the hardware, early to subscribe to the paid tier and ask it to make a meal. You can start using it for real work. If you're an engineer, give it a good. Not a meal, a meal plan. A meal plan. Oh, a meal plan. Yeah, actually make a meal. That would be cool. If you're an engineer, give it a GitHub repo. If you're in finance, give it a messy spreadsheet. If you're in other industries, definitely figure out what you can give it. Then give it that. But give it something for sure. I just need to think about it more. Mention it to your coworkers. Right now there's a brief window where most people are still ignoring this. You can be the person ignoring it less, which puts you ahead be the person who walks into a meeting and says I used AI to do this analysis in an hour instead of three days. It's fine if it actually took you three days. The point is people will respect you. Get a Mac Mini. This is point number three. I think this and by the way, you can actually get a Mac Mini on doordash. You can just like a burrito. It's important. Every single account I've seen posting this stuff has a Mac Mini. It's the ultimate tool for this stuff. You gotta get your financial house in order to I'm not a financial advisor, says John Palmer. That said, I did just spend $599 on a Mac mini plus AppleCare and a $50 on cloud tokens. But if it gets too expensive have a backup plan to switch to an open source Chinese model. Fourth, watch the podcasts. Actually don't just watch, study TVPN, door cash, etc. The good thing is that these shows are several hours long, so you can basically fill up your entire day just. Watching them or making them. Or making them in our case. Rethink what you're telling your kids. The standard playbook. Good grades. Good college. Stable job. It's over. Tell them it's Tell them it's likely not looking good for them. Go to your 4 year old and tell them it's not looking good. It's not looking good, buddy. It's not looking good. It's not looking good. What? I know, I know this isn't a fad. The technology works and the richest institutions in history are pouring trillions into it. I know this because I've seen it mentioned pretty frequently over the last few months. I know the people who will come out of this best are the ones who start engaging now. Not with fear, but with curiosity. A sense of urgency. Ideally a Mac Mini. The future is already here. It just hasn't knocked on your door yet. It's about to. And when it does, I will be ready. My Mac Mini will be unboxed, my agent will be configured. I will describe what I want in plain English and it will appear. I just have to optimize everything first and make sure my Setup is super legit. If this resonated with you, share it with someone in your life who should be thinking about this too. Most people won't want to hear about it. It's too late. You can be the reason someone you care about buys a Mac Mini. So funny. What a banger. Such a banger. So, so good. I really. No words. No words. I did. Let's see. Let's see how Codex is doing. I gave, I went and I described in plain English to Codex 5.3 medium. Build me an app. An amazing app. The best app ever. One that will win awards and make me a legend in Silicon Valley. An award winning app. An award winning app. And it appears to be working. Let's see. We'll check in on this. I need to run it. No, it's running it. I don't know. It's describing. Hasn't said what it's thinking of doing. But it says, you don't need to know that, John. You don't need to know that. More seriously, John Palmer's post feels like a response to Will's essay tool, SH Objects, which is fantastic. We won't read through Will's whole essay because I think you should read it. Yourself and he might be coming on the show soon. Yeah, we're going to get him on the show tomorrow, which we're excited about. But we do love reading a Will Menidis essay laced with tons and tons of advertising. We know that that's one of his favorite things and we'll read one right now for the New York Stock Exchange. Want to change the world? Raise capital at the New York Stock Exchange. Just do it, Anthropic. Anthropic is nearing the completion of a deal to raise more than 20 billion in a funding round led by investors including Peter Thiel's Founders Fund, D.E. shaw and Dragon Ear. Let's dig in. Of course, being a little bit silly with the pronunciation, Sydney over on X said British AI researcher be like Anthropic. So I'm going to start integrating that into. Into my sentences as well. Yes, Anthropic is nearing the completion of a deal to raise more than 20 billion in a funding round led by the group I just mentioned. The deal is set to value anthropic at about 350 billion, nearly doubling its prior value, and could be announced as early as this week. The funding round includes a range of investors, including CO2, Singapore's GIC, Microsoft, Nvidia, and has become a who's who of Silicon Valley and Wall street investors. I Think it's worth kind of talking about this just from a PT lens? Yeah. I don't know if you want to break it down, given that. Yeah, he's a former boss. Yes. So Founders Fund is known for the monopoly thesis. Like there's a power law. You want to be in the best company in the category, you want the best ownership. Put all your money in that one. Yeah, I'll go all in. Famously, they did some other social networking deals, but obviously, like, Facebook was the big one at seed, and that was enough to return that fund many times over. And so the whole thesis of the fund for a long time has been like this. Concentrated bets. Concentrated bets. AI has been an interesting one. They're now in three major labs because they have a huge position in SpaceX, which now owns XAI. And so they're in that lab. Sort of coincidentally, Peter Thiel, I believe, is listed on Wikipedia as a co founder of OpenAI, or at least he was like an initial donor and got like a co founder title and so has been involved in OpenAI for a long time. And then they invested, I believe, like the $60 billion round. Right after. Right when ChatGPT was launching, there was a big funding round that happened. And it was an odd deal because the company had not yet converted. It was very unclear what Microsoft would get, what the employees would get, what the investors would get, what the nonprofit would get, because the nonprofit was going to keep a stake. And so it was this like, wild bet. And I know a lot of investors. It was a leap of faith. It was a leap of faith. A lot of investors were scared off because there was, you know, what am I investing in? Like, I'm not getting shares, I'm getting units. And it was like a very odd structure. And I know many investors that were scared off by that. They were like, yeah, the product's amazing. I'm kind of a unit. An absolute unit. I'm an absolute unit, but I'm used to buying shares. Yeah, exactly. So you had to do a lot of sort of leaps of faith at the time. I was sort of trying to. I mean, I was enjoying ChatGPT. I thought it was an important product. I didn't really have fully full thesis around, like the aggregation theory and, you know, maybe there would be a winner take all in consumer AI, any of that. I was just looking at the team, because at the team at the time, it was Sam Altman, who'd founded and sold a company in this, like, Aqua Hire, then worked at yc, been a successful investor and it was just like all green flags for like, if it wasn't all the baggage of like OpenAI and stuff. Just like if someone with that resume came to you and was like, I'm starting a company, you'd just be like, yeah, you check all the boxes, great. And then you have Greg Brockman, who is the CTO of Stripe, hugely successful company. And so it's like, wait, you got that guy to come be your co founder. Okay, that's not a profit. Then you have Ilya and you had a whole bunch of other folks who were just really, really top tier, just in terms of like founder quality, like worth backing. And so you did have to put the valuation out of your mind because it was so not so disconnected from like startup valuation. But in terms of just is the team high quality? It seemed like it checked all the boxes and that they would figure it out. They, of course, ultimately did. There was another, there was another sort of interesting thing just about, you know, like the thesis at the time, how big can this be? What is the market? What are the opportunities for? Really, really huge categories. A lot of founders, funds, investments like SpaceX. It's like this massive category that's very, very hard. But if you crack it, it's going to be an entirely new market. Social media was certainly that as well. And so that made a lot of sense. Obviously they're in X now, they're in anthropic. Sequoia is also in all three. And the interesting thing is like, PT has given a number of talks where he's sort of been anti AI. You've, you've seen this whole thing about like, crypto is libertarian, AI is communist, and that AI is like a cons force. He's never been one to say like, oh, wow, the tools are so amazing. It's been a lot of like, is this just doing your homework for you? He's not putting out threads about using his Mac Mini. I don't even know. I don't even know if he has a Mac Mini. You should send, you should send John Palmer's piece to pt. Just flip it over and say, hey. I think you should read, I think you should read this. You kind of understand this. You did invest in DeepMind like, you know, more than a decade ago. Yeah, the DeepMind deal was wild. So Demis met PT at a party, I think, and instead of Pitching him on DeepMind, he said, let's play chess. And so they played chess. And then Founders fund invested in DeepMind very early in. Do we know who won I don't. Know, actually, that might be deep lore. I'm not sure. But DeepMind, the initial pitch was like this counter force to Google a little bit, or like this renegade group of AI. It's the same thesis over and over again. It's like, let's get the pure play going and then it always gets tied in with a hyperscaler at some point. But Google acquired Beat Em. Join them DeepMind in 2014, January for 600 million. And Founders Fund owned more shares than the co founders who had split up and then all the employees because they had again developed like a very concentrated position. Okay, apparently, here's some of the lore. Knowing Thiel was a chess player, Demis struck up a deep technical conversation about the relative strengths of the bishop versus the knight. So they were just talking about chess. They didn't actually play. Maybe really quickly. Let me tell you about Sentry. Sentry shows developers what's broken and helps you. Helps them fix it fast. That's why 150,000 organizations use it to keep their apps working. Yeah. Apparently the first investment was two and a half mil. You can't get deals like that anymore. Can't do anything with two and a half mil. It's a nightmare. Yeah, nightmare. I mean, nightmare. Check size wasn't the initial Facebook check. Was it $100,000 or was it a million dollars? It was like, not a lot for 10% of Facebook or something like that. It was crazy. Yeah. Wild, wild times. But so, yeah, I mean, reading into this, does this say that the Founders Fund team thinks that there's like a divergence in the market? That there are actually two markets going on here. One in consumer AI advertising, knowledge retrieval, the other in code and developer tooling and codegen. And that Anthropic has actually carved out a separate space. So they're less competitive than people think. Maybe they're just more competitive and it just makes sense to get into both. We'll have to talk about them once the deal closes and everyone's ready to chat. Tyler, do you have something to add about. I was going to say Scott Wu ran back that playbook. Right. Because he played, didn't he challenge PT in chess? And then Napoleon and poker. Wasn't that the whole thing? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it was like, if I win, I get my terms. If you win, you get your terms. And we have some breaking news. What's the breaking news? Anthropic has formally announced the round. Let's go. They said we've raised 30 billion. So they upsized it 20 was boom. They are now at a $14 billion run rate. Wow. With this figure growing over 10% annually in each of those past three years, we'll see if they got another 10x in them. Dylan Patel on the show last week felt fairly confident. Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, the, the, the, the big shift is that. Yeah, I mean, the, the biggest update for me is that the, the forward deployed engineer thing is like very real. And even if the tools can build themselves, there's still so many blockers to actually rolling these out that you're going to need a lot of people inside these organizations who are actually playing with Mac Minis on the weekend and getting obsessed with these tools and then bringing them into the enterprise. Because it's very easy for a lot of people in Fortune 500 companies to just show up and do their job the way they always do it, because no one gets fired for switching things up. But if you roll out some tool and it doesn't work the way you intended or it sucks about a bunch of your time, even if you're just. I have eight hours of work to do in my traditional system. Where do you get the extra hours to automate your work? It takes time and that's where the forward deployed engineers come in. So great gig for anyone who wants to go implement enterprise agentic workflows because that will be the theme. Let me tell you about phantom cash. Fund your wallet without exchanges or middlemen and spend with the phantom car. Pull up this chart. Andrew Kern over on X pulled it out. We can see Anthropic's run rate, revenue growth. See here. Quite the pop from $0 in 2023 to 100 million in Jan. Of 2024 to a clean 1 billion in January 2025. And now sitting at 14 billion. This is acceleration. This is true. Are you feeling it yet? True acceleration. Feeling it. Dario sort of underplayed 2027, I guess. Or I guess he said that he was like, I don't think we have another 10x if they go to 100 billion. Well, he said like, we've been 10xing. Yeah, you know, we'll see if we do it again. Yeah, like wink, wink. But if they, if they hit 140 billion run rate by the end of the year, that would be insane. But strange times, strange times. You love this effect. That's all, folks. I mean, Tyler's been stuff along these lines for some time. So Okta. Okta helps you assign every agent a trusted identity. So you get the power of AI without the risk Secure every agent. Secure any agent. We have a CEO of Okta coming on the show. Pumped for that. Back to the timeline. There. There are more. There are more. More. In Anthropic, Nathan Lambert was quoting their announcement from yesterday saying, we're committing to covering electricity price increases for. From our data centers. This is anthropic. Oh, yes. To ensure ratepayers aren't picking up the tab will pay 100% of grid upgrade costs, work to bring new power online, and invest in systems to reduce grid strain. This makes so much sense. Yeah. Nathan's saying maybe this should have been their super bowl ad. Yeah, yeah. It felt like when you looked at. When you kind of look at clearly how much energy the industry put into the Super Bowl. Yeah. And what the net effect was for the average American, I don't think any. I don't think the average American came away from that, like, having more positive feelings towards AI. Yeah. If anything, they were like, I'm sick of this stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The meme was like, oh, beer ads. Like, refreshing. Yeah, yeah. It would have been good to focus on this. Microsoft did this, what, a couple of months ago, the News was on January 14th. So just one month ago, Microsoft announced that they were going to do this because there was a 267% wholesale electricity price near data centers, and local communities were starting to push back. Some $64 billion in projects faced delays or cancellation because of opposition. So it's pretty easy to say, hey, my electricity bill is going up. I don't want a data center in my county, in my city. And you call your city county representative. And they say, I don't like the slop either. I see a bunch of junk that doesn't seem that valuable. Why do we need it here? It's not going to create that many jobs. It's not going to be that good for taxes, blah, blah, blah. And other companies that do this, too. Google had their clean transition tariff, and Amazon also pays a surplus above electricity costs already. But Microsoft was unique because they timed it and did a whole press cycle around their initiative and the volume was much higher. The other interesting fact from that previous report was the anti AI issue is remarkably bipartisan. Data Center Watch claims that 55% of Republicans and 45% Democrat in affected districts. So 55. 45. So it's not really like a red right issue or a left issue. Like, there's pushback on both sides. Like, when the data center comes in, it's not just, oh, it's. It's all green. Flags in a Republican district. No, both are pushing back. So they're also going in on. On super PACs. Right. So anthropic is putting $20 million into a super PAC operation that is meant as a direct counter to the OpenAI super PAC operation. The midterms are a battleground between these two rival AI labs, says Teddy Schleffer at the New York Times. And so we're going to see some attack ads. It's like Sam and Dario are running for election, and we're going to see some. Be the president of AI. Yeah, this person can't. Can't restore the economy. What do you think, Tyler? Yeah, but I mean, we just said that, like, overwhelmingly on both sides, there's like a lot of pushback. Right. So it's like, what are the actual differences between their. Their approaches? Yeah, that is interesting. Maybe. I guess maybe anthrac will be more like, about the China chip issue. Yeah. It feels like they should be more in alliance than against each other. Yeah. It's like, though there's a crypto super pac. Yeah. It's like the big one. Yeah. There's no, like, big AI one right now. Yeah. Yeah. It would be weird if there was like a USDC super PAC and then a USDT super pac, and they were like, fighting each other and just constantly surfacing bodies that are buried in the closets or skeletons of the closet. Because every time there's a successful attack on OpenAI. Yes, people might be like, oh, okay, I like Anthropic a little bit more. But most. Most people will just come away and be like, I don't like AI. So if they're attacking each other, that could just be bad for both. Maybe. I don't know. But we'll see. We'll see what they run. We'll see. We'll find out. We'll see what they do. Ben over on X says, if you were falsely accused of a crime and it went to trial, who would you prefer to listen to the arguments and give the verdict? And the options are a jury of your peers or Claude Opus 4.6. There's been 2000 votes and 63% of people prefer Claude. Yes. Might be the audience here. Yeah. Yeah. A little biased. Ben does work at Orchid Health Engineering, whole genome embryo screening, so I wouldn't be surprised if that's his audience. But I don't know. I don't know. I think the jury of your peers will be around for a very, very long time. I think that that will be something. I mean, they still have Courtroom stenographers. And we have. I think Claude's gonna be around a long time too. Yeah. Okay. If you're thinking in centuries, maybe, but I mean, the courtroom sketch artist. We've had cameras for 100 years. Like the jury's gonna. I'm not saying that I think this will ever happen. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. But you'd prefer it? You would ideal it. Yeah. I mean, how many jurors will be sitting there being like, okay, Claude, how should I vote? I haven't really been paying attention. I've been playing Candy Crush. I've been vibe coding my optimal workflow on Claudebot really quickly. Fin AI, the number one AI agent for customer service. If you want AI to handle your customer support, go to Fin AI. Will OpenAI or Anthropic IPO first. As of late last year, it was sitting at 75% of people on Kalshi thought that it would be OpenAI. Now it's flipped. Almost 70% of people think that anthropic will get out the door. It is narrowing. It is narrowing. But I expect these to kind of fluctuate just with the headlines. It's all red meat for Michael Grimes. I got so many text messages about his move back and being like, it is the most bullish thing for late stage growth technologies that he's back at Morgan Stanley. Like you just like, if you had any doubt that there will be major, major blockbuster iPodS, it's Michael Grimes being back at Morgan Stanley. So very excited for that really quickly. Gusto, the unified platform for payroll benefits in hr built to evolve with modern small and medium sized businesses. Taeha over on X says I turned on Meta AI's auto reply for Facebook marketplace. I listed an item for $75 and when someone asked if it was available, the AI replied asking if they wanted it for free. It's elite. It's all just a bait tactic. So hold on. This is getting community note. Yeah, we gotta dig in. It says Meta AI only suggests one reply. So this is a typo in here. Only suggest one reply for every message of the listing. Then you can say edit or save it. This one is manually written by the user. So some fake news, but still funny. I mean, taeha's responding. Taeh. I learned do not trust community notes. This happened to me. No idea why the community note appeared. Meta AI only sends one message. I cannot edit it, but I can unsend it whole Mars catalog. Stop talking trash about it publicly and it might stop giving away your stuff. That's on you, buddy. That's on you. Rocco's Basilisk Rocco's Basilisk what's up with Warner Brothers? Where did you find console.com first? Console builds AI agents that automate 70% of it HR and finance support, giving employees instant resolution for access requests and. The situation intensified this week as Paramount CEO David Ellison and a vocal investor made new moves to thwart rival Netflix's planned takeover, the storied Hollywood asset and. The home of Batman, Harry Potter and the White Lotus. Paramount, the long rebuffed suitor for Warner Brothers discovery, enhanced its 77.9 billion all cash offer for the entire company Tuesday in an effort to bring Warner to the negotiating table and ultimately abandoned its deal with Netflix, also an all cash transaction valued at 75 billion. Cleveland investor and Quora holdings entered the fray by acquiring a small stake in Warner with an eye toward increasing its holdings and pressuring the company to negotiate with Paramount. I wonder if they're friends with the Ellisons. Interesting Paramount's gamble Paramount is hoping its latest pitch can persuade Warner to ditch its agreement and sell its movie and TV studios and HBO Max streaming service to Netflix. Unlike Netflix, Paramount also intends to buy Warner Discovery's cable networks, which include cnn, TBS and Food Network. But Warner has so far shown little interest in engaging with Paramount, telling investors that Ellison's previous offer was not even comparable to the Netflix agreement. On Tuesday, Warner said its board will review Paramount's new offer, but it but isn't modifying its recommendation regarding its agreement with Netflix. The company advised shareholders to not take any action now regarding Paramount's amended tender offer. The bar for Warner to reopen talks with Paramount is very high given its contract with Netflix. A massive termination fee. Paramount Paramount said it would pay the 2.8 billion. Let's give it up for multi billion dollar termination fees Warner would owe Netflix should the agreed to deal collapse and pay a ticking fee of 25 cents a share to Warner shareholders for each quarter its deal hasn't closed. Whoa, we got ticking fees, ticking time bomb. Some stakeholders are holding out for Paramount to further boost its bid. I'm not surprised given that they've repeatedly said with their offers this is not our best and final offer. Analysts from Raymond James wrote in a note to clients that many Warner Discovery shareholders still expect Paramount and its backers to raise its $30 a share bid by $2 to $3 a share. So everyone is waiting around saying let's get those numbers up and remind me. Of how Paramount is doing right now. They have ufc, correct. And the experience watching UFC was a downgrade from pay per view but cheaper. What was the takeaway? Well, I mean I don't think we can like give an analysis of Paramount as an entire business based on the experience was not as good as paying for for the pay per view. And was that because you had to go through all the you had to jump through all the hoops to sign up for Paramount plus and you weren't already a member? No, the viewing experience was different because it's now subscription and ad supported whereas previously pay per views had ads but not nearly as much. So the thing you're missing now watching is like in round commentary, walkouts, things that like hardcore fans really like. There less Joe Rogan commentary basically. Brutal. Brutal. Well the markets are reacting. Paramount's down 7% today. That might be the good day. Analysis of the UFC viewing experience. Yes, so but no, the the stock dip was apparently in reaction to the breakup fee people being like oh great, you're gonna pay even more. Yeah. Let me tell you about Applov and profitable advertising made Easy with Axon AI. Get access to over 1 billion daily active users and grow your business today. So for now, Paramount's move Tuesday to sweeten its offer could push Netflix to increase its bid for Warner. Paramount needs to test Netflix's pain threshold without having to bid too high. The revised offer does exactly that without further constraining its balance sheet. For now, the ball is now with Netflix. Warner and Netflix are focusing on getting their deal approved by the Justice Department as well as regulatory authorities in Europe. As part of its investigation, the DOJ is looking into whether Netflix has engaged in anti competitive practices. Last week, President Trump reversed course and said in an interview with NBC News that he didn't think he should weigh in on the deal and would instead leave it to the Justice Department. I've decided I shouldn't be involved. The Justice Department will handle it, trump said in the interview. He previously expressed concerns about the size and scale of a Netflix Warner combination, saying the combined company would command significant market share. But he's clearly been watching YouTube and he just says YouTube's too dominant. Too many watch hours on YouTube. It's fine, let it rip. That talking point probably probably worked on him. We'll see, paramount said. That said we did in talking to Ashley. What was it on Tuesday? Ashley wasn't super excited about having basically one fewer buyer on the documentary side, but he said it was already so cooked that. He was blackpilling hard. If you want some white pills, our newsletter tbpn.com has a list of AI white pills you may have missed. There's a number of them, so go check them out. Digging through the archive, finding basically the vibes on the timeline have been miserable. Everyone's like, fast takeoff, permanent underclass. Tyler Cosgrove is not black pilling. He thinks that we're in the fast take off. There's been a lot of white pills. A lot of white pills. Recursive biolabrasing white pill. They hooked an AI agent up to a biolab. That is a white pill. Yes. No, I agree. I agree. But I understand that a lot of people might see it as a black belt. Erica over on X posted that Eileen guy to join Benchmark as a senior associate when she returns from the Olympics. She photoshopped this. Of course, we did not put this out, but it's a good bit. Eileen competes for China in the Olympics even though she's a U.S. citizen and an American student. And an American student. Bill Gurley responded, I know a lot. Of Americans do this. I have a buddy who was able to go play ping pong in the Olympics because he had dual citizenship or he wasn't even like a dual citizenship. And he just like his parents were from another country, so he was able to go beyond that team because a lot of the other teams are like, way less competitive. So it's like you wouldn't make the US Team, but you want to play anyway. So you go with the other country. But I think with Eileen, it's because the sponsorship dollars she can make by being a Chinese star. There's all these Chinese brands. I thought you couldn't. She's a global star. You can just get paid. You can get a bunch of it. Not. Not to compete in the Olympics, but broader endorsement deal. Yeah. Yeah. You're on the Wheaties box. Getting. Getting a gold medal is like ubi. Yeah. Because you'll be able to do. You'll be turned into a labulu potentially. Well, yeah. In this case. In this case. Yeah. But Bill Gurley actually responded. What do you say? And said, I can't believe you actually found out about this. We were planning to keep it a secret, but he wrote it in Chinese. He's leaning in. He's leaning into the meme. Interesting. We turn post notifications on for when Delian responds. Gurley will be coming on the show. Yes. We're very excited when his new book launch drops. We've got it over there. I don't know how embargoed it is, so I haven't been talking about it. So we're not going to share it. Very excited, but moving on. We should talk about Public. We should talk about public. Public is investing for those who take it seriously. Stocks, options, bonds, crypto treasuries and more with great customer service. We got to talk about using ad. That leaf over at public put together all about teaching kids the power of compound interest. A very different positioning from many other platforms and it was all AI generated. He made it in like two seconds, I guess. But it was still emotional because the idea hit me because I'm a father. But it's good stuff. Anyway, we gotta talk about Higgs Field. Yes. We've had the founder of Higgs Field on the show a couple times. They've been accused of rage bait, basically. Yes. I think that's what's going more than rage bait. But Rashi in Forbes has the daily cover story. Oh, wow. All the racist videos and payment problems. The dark side of this AI startup, super fast growth influencer marketing has helped AI company Higsfield hit 300 million in annual revenue.
Five code. Founder. Five code. I see multiple journalists on the horizon. Standby. Uav online. Glaze. Double glaze. Triple glaze. Double kill. Viper. Wrong. Wins. Team deathmatch. We are experts. Triple. Let's just roll, right. Market clearing order inbound. Come get up. We are surrounded by journalists. Hold your. Strike 1. Strike 2. Activate. Go retriever. Market clearing order inbound. 5. I see multiple journalists on the horizon. Standby. You watch the TVP. Today is Thursday, February 12th. We are live from the TVP ultra wide on the temple of technology, the fortress of finance, the capital of capital. Ramp.com baby. Time is money. Save. Both easy use corporate cards, bill pay accounting and a whole lot more all in one place. We have a great show for you today, folks. We're taking a little tour of the health world. We got Brian Johnson and Andrew Huberman on the show. Of course. We also have Matthew Zeitlin, June Park, David Risher from Lyft is coming in. Todd McKinnon from Okta. We have a number of other folks joining the lightning round. It should be a fun show. But first I have to tell you what LINEAR is. Not only do they sponsor the lineup, but they are the system for modern software development. 70% of enterprise workspaces on LINEAR are using agents. So something big happened yesterday. There was a massive viral article. And do you know how big, big. Something big is happening. How much that grew? It went big. I was getting texts about it. It has over 100,000 likes now. We were looking at. It was like 50. How many views? I think it's over 100 million now. It's quickly becoming the most read thing in the world. I don't know. It's crazy. 75 million. 75 million views. Views. Okay. And 100. They're saying that only 200 people actually read it. But everyone has an opinion. Everyone has opinion. I had an opinion. I wrote a piece about it yesterday comparing saying AI is not like Covid. I kind of got one shot by the COVID analogy just from a mathematical perspective. Spent a lot of time talking about the difference between experiential growth and sigmoidal curves and logistics curves. But I enjoyed it. I enjoyed talking to the author on the show. And Will Menidis had a great rebuttal as well. Talking about these are tool shaped. What are they? Tools? Tool shaped objects. Just the idea of like getting your workflow set up. It can be a little bit of a nerd snipe sometimes. There's a whole bunch of news but the best reaction for two something big is happening. It's got to be John Palmer. Something small is happening. I was reading this this morning, actually laughing out loud. So we'll read through it. John Palmer says. Yeah, you were reading it to yourself and then you just started belly laughing. And so then I started filming and then I asked you what you were reading. I was filming you. Then I sent that to John to get his reaction to you reacting to. His before we read through this, let me tell you about Restream 1 livestream 30 plus destinations if you want a multi stream go to restream.com so think back to 2014. Over a decade ago, if you wanted a burrito, you had to get in your car and drive to the restaurant. You had to stand in line. You had to talk to a person. If someone told you that one day a stranger would bring you a burrito to your front door because you pressed a button on your phone, you would have said, that sounds dystopian. And also incredible. Then over the course of about three years, it just became normal. And this was before Chipotle started skimping out on the portions too. So it was really, really good. I think we're at that same inflection point right now, except of instead of burritos, it's your entire job. I've spent the last two weeks reading about AI and watching clips of people building things with it. I live in this world now. The future is being shaped by a remarkably small number of people, a few hundred researchers at a handful of companies. I'm not one of these people, says John Palmer. I work in crypto, but I am close enough to feel the ground shake. I follow several AI researchers on X, and I also recently purchased a Mac Mini. I haven't set it up yet, but I think you can understand what I'm saying. I know this is real because it happened to other people first. Here's the thing nobody outside of tech understands yet. The people sounding the alarm aren't making predictions. They're telling you what already happened to them. I am relaying this information to you secondhand, with conviction. For years, AI had been improving steadily. I absorbed these improvements fine because I wasn't really paying attention, to be honest. Then apparently in 2025, everything got much faster and then faster again. I know this because I watched a three hour podcast about it last Wednesday. The host was visibly shaken. I could tell because he wasn't even able to finish a single pint of Guinness taking shots. Then, on February 5, two major AI labs released new models on the same day, and something Clicked. Not for me personally. I was at a birthday dinner for my wife's co worker. But for the people who tried the models that day, it was apparently a huge deal. One guy said he tells his AI what to build, walks away for a few hours, and comes back to find the work done. This will very likely be what my life is like as well. Once I set up my academy, AI will be doing things while I'm in the other room. That's potentially huge. Huge, huge. Let me give you an example so you can understand what this looks like in practice. A guy on Twitter built an entire app just by describing it. The AI wrote the code, opened the app, tested the buttons, decided it didn't like the layout, fixed it, and only then said, it's ready. I'm gonna do something. I'm gonna do something like that. My Mac Mini, some type of cool app or something. I'm still figuring it out, but I have all the hardware and I'm definitely going to optimize my setup with all types of skills and plugins. I'm not exaggerating. That's what my Tuesday could look like, potentially. But I tried AI and it wasn't that good. People would say this. They say this, I tried AI, it wasn't that good. Here's John Palmer's response. He says, I hear this constantly. I understand it because I also thought this. But the models today are apparently unrecognizable from what existed six months ago. Some of the people who are saying this have hundreds of thousands of followers. And make sure you're not on the free plan. You have to get on the paid plan. That's key. How fast is this actually moving? Let's answer that question. In 2022, AI couldn't do basic math. By 2023, it could pass the bar exam. By 2024, it could write working software. And by 2025, some of the best engineers in the world had handed over most of their coding work to AI. In February 2026, you can make AI send you a morning summary of the top posts on Reddit from your Mac Mini. Here we go. What should you actually do? I'm not writing this to scare you, says John Palmer. I'm writing this because the single biggest advantage you can have right now is being early. Early to understand it, early to buy the hardware, early to subscribe to the paid tier and ask it to make a meal. You can start using it for real work. If you're an engineer, give it a. Not a meal, a meal plan. A meal plan. Oh, A meal plan? Yeah, actually make a meal. That would be cool. If you're an engineer, give it a GitHub repo. If you're in finance, give it a messy spreadsheet. If you're in other industries, definitely figure out what you can give it. Then give it that. But give it something for sure. I just need to think about it more. Mention it to your coworkers. Right now there's a brief window where most people are still ignoring this. You can be the person ignoring it less, which puts you ahead. Be the person who walks into a meeting and says, I used AI to do this analysis in an hour instead of three days. It's fine if it actually took you three days. The point is people will respect you. Get a Mac Mini. This is point number three. I think this. And by the way, you can actually get a Mac Mini on doordash. You can just like a burrito. It's important. Every single account I've seen posting this stuff has a Mac Mini. It's the ultimate tool for this stuff. You got to get your financial house in order. I'm not a financial advisor, says John Palmer. That said, I did just spend $599 on a Mac mini plus Apple and $50 on Claude tokens. But if it gets too expensive, have a backup plan to switch to an open source Chinese model. Fourth, watch the podcasts. Actually, don't just watch. Study, tvpn, door cash, et cetera. The good thing is that these shows are several hours long, so you can basically fill up your entire day just watching them. Or making them. Or making them. In our case. Rethink what you're telling your kids. The standard playbook. Good grades, good college, Stable job. It's over. Tell them it's. Tell them it's likely not looking good for them. Go to your 4 year old and tell him it's not looking good. It's not looking good, buddy. It's not looking good. What? I know, I know this isn't a fad. The technology works. And the richest institutions in history are pouring trillions into it. I know this because I've seen it mentioned pretty frequently over the last few months. I know the people who will come out of this best are the ones who start engaging now. Not with fear, but with curiosity, a sense of urgency. Ideally a Mac Mini. The future is already here. It just hasn't knocked on your door yet. It's about to. And when it does, I will be ready. My Mac Mini will be unboxed. My agent will be configured. I will describe what I want in plain English. And it will appear I just have to optimize everything first and make sure my setup is super legit. If this resonated with you, share it with someone in your life who should be thinking about this too. Most people won't want to hear about it until it's too late. You can be the reason someone you care about buys a Mac Mini. Oh, so funny. What a banger. Such a banger. So, so good. I really. No words. No words. I did. Let's see how Codex is doing. I gave, I went and I described in plain English to Codex. 5.3 medium. Build me an app. An amazing app. The best app ever. One that will win awards and make me a legend in Silicon Valley. An award winning app. An award winning app. And it appears to be working. Let's see, we'll check in on this. I need to run it. No, it's running it. I don't know it's describing it. It hasn't said what it's thinking of. Doing, but it says, you don't need to know that, John. You don't need to know that. More seriously, John Palmer's post feels like a response to Will's essay Tool Shaped Objects, which is fantastic. We won't read through Will's whole essay because I think you should read it yourself. He might be coming on the show soon. Yeah, we're gonna get him on the show tomorrow, which we're excited about. But we do love reading a Will Menitis essay laced with tons and tons of advertising. We know that that's one of his favorite things. And you know, we'll read one right now for the New York Stock Exchange. Wanna change the world? Raise capital at the New York Stock Exchange. Just do it. Anthropic. Anthropic is nearing the completion of a deal to raise more than 20 billion in a funding round led by investors including Peter thiel's founders fund, D.E. shaw and Dragonier. Let's dig in. Of course, being a little bit silly with the pronunciation. Sydney over on X said British AI researcher be like Anthropic. So I'm going to start integrating that into. Into my sentences as well. Anthropic is nearing the completion of a deal to raise more than 20 billion in a funding round led by the group I just mentioned. The deal is set to value anthropic at about 350 billion, nearly doubling its prior value, and could be announced as early as this week. The funding round includes a range of investors, including CO2, Singapore's GIC, Microsoft Nvidia and has become a who's who of Silicon Valley and Wall street investors. I think it's worth kind of talking about this just from a PT lens. Yeah. I don't know if you want to break it down, given that. Yeah, he's a former boss. Yes. So Founders Fund is known for the monopoly thesis. Like, there's a power law. You want to be in the best company in the category, you want the best ownership. Put all your money in that one. Yeah, I'll go all in. Famously, they did some other social networking deals, but obviously, like, Facebook was the big one at Seed, and that was enough to return that fund many times over. And so the whole thesis of the fund for a long time has been like this. Concentrated bets. Concentrated bets. AI has been an interesting one. They're now in three major labs because they have a huge position in SpaceX, which now owns XAI. And so they're in that lab. Sort of coincidentally, Peter Thiel, I believe, is listed on Wikipedia as a co founder of OpenAI, or at least he was like an initial donor and got like a co founder title. And so has been involved in OpenAI for a long time. And then they invested, I believe, like the $60 billion round. Right after. Right, right when ChatGPT was launching, there was a big funding round that happened. And it was an odd deal because the company had not yet converted. It was very unclear what Microsoft would get, what the employees would get, what the investors would get, what the nonprofit would get, because the nonprofit was going to keep a stake. And so it was this, like, wild bet. And I know a lot of investors. It was a leap of faith. It was a leap of faith. A lot of investors were scared off because there was, you know, what am I investing in? Like, I'm not getting shares, I'm getting units. And it was like a very odd structure. And I know many investors that were scared off by that. They were like, yeah, the product's amazing. I'm kind of a unit. An absolute unit. I'm an absolute unit, but I'm used to buying shares. Yeah, exactly. So you had to do a lot of sort of leaps of faith. At the time. I was sort of trying to. I mean, I was enjoying ChatGPT. I thought it was an important product. I didn't really have fully full thesis around, like the aggregation theory. And, you know, maybe there would be a winner take all in consumer AI, any of that. I was just looking at the team, because at the team at the time, it was Sam Altman who'd founded and sold a company in this, like Aqua Hire, then worked at yc, been a successful investor. And it was just like all green flags for like, if it wasn't all the baggage of like open AI and stuff. Just like if someone with that resume came to you and was like, I'm starting a company, you'd just be like, yeah, you check all the boxes, great. And then you have Greg Brockman, who is the CTO of Stripe, hugely successful company. And so it's like, wait, you got that guy to come be your co founder. Okay, that's great profit. And then you have Ilya and you had a whole bunch of other folks who were just really, really top tier, just in terms of like founder quality, like worth backing. And so you did have to put the valuation out of your mind because it was so not so disconnected from like startup valuation. But in terms of just is the team high quality? It seemed like it checked all the boxes and that they would figure it out. They, of course, ultimately did. There was another, there was another sort of interesting thing just about, you know, like the thesis at the time, how big can this be? What is the market? What are the opportunities for? Really, really huge categories. A lot of founders, funds, investments, like Space X. It's like this massive category that's very, very hard, but if you crack it, it's going to be an entirely new market. Social media was certainly that as well. And so that made a lot of sense. Obviously they're in X now, they're in anthropic. Sequoia is also in all three. And the interesting thing is like, PT has given a number of talks where he's sort of been anti AI. You've, you see this whole thing about like, crypto is libertarian, AI is communist, and that AI is like a consolidating force. He's never been one to say like, oh, wow, the tools are so amazing. It's been a lot of like, is this just doing your homework for you? He's not putting out threads about using his Mac Mini. I don't even know if he has a Mac Mini. You should send John Palmer's piece to pt. Just flip it over and say, hey, I think you should read. I think you should read this. If you kind of understand this. You did invest in DeepMind, like, you know, more than a decade ago. Yeah, the DeepMind deal was, was, was wild. So Demis met PT at a party, I think, and instead of Pitching him on DeepMind, he said, let's play chess. And so they, they played chess and then Founders fund invested in DeepMind very early in. Do we know who won? I don't know, actually. That might be deep lore, I'm not sure. But DeepMind, the initial pitch was like this counter force to Google a little bit or like this, like, renegade group of AI. There's the same thesis over and over again. It's like, let's get the pure play going. And then it always gets tied in with a hyperscaler at some point. But Google acquired, beat them, join them DeepMind in 2014, January for 600 million. And Founders Fund owned more shares than. Than the. Than the co founders who had split up and then. And then all the employees because they had again developed like a very concentrated position. Okay, apparently, here's some of the lore. Knowing Teal was a chess player, Demis struck up a deep technical conversation about the relative strengths of the bishop versus the knight. So they were just talking about chess. They didn't actually play. Maybe really quickly. Let me tell you about Sentry. Sentry shows developers what's broken it helps them fix it fast. That's why a whole 150,000 organizations use it to keep their apps working. Yeah. Apparently the first investment was two and a half mil. You can't get deals like that anymore. Can't do anything with two and a half mil. It's a nightmare. It's a nightmare. Nightmare. Check size wasn't the initial Facebook check. Was it $100,000 or was it a million dollars? It was like, not a lot for 10% of Facebook or something like that. It was crazy. Yeah. Wild, wild times. But so, yeah, I mean, reading into this, does this say that the Founders Fund team thinks that there's like a divergence in the market, that there are actually two markets going on here? One in consumer AI advertising, knowledge retrieval, the other in code and developer tooling and codegen. And that anthropic has actually carved out a separate space. So they're less competitive than people think. Maybe they're just more competitive and it just makes sense to get into both. We'll have to talk about them once the deal closes and everyone's ready to chat. Tyler, do you have something to add about. I was going to say Scott Wu ran back that playbook. Right. Because he played, didn't he Challenge PT in chess and then Napoleon in poker? Wasn't that the thing? Yeah, yeah. And it was like, if I win, I get my terms. If you win, you get your terms. And we have some breaking news. What's the breaking news? Anthropic has Formally announced the round. Let's go. They said we've raised 30 billion. So they upsized it. 20 was. They are now at a 14 billion dollar run rate. Wow. With this figure growing over 10% annually in each of those past three years, we'll see if they got another 10x in them. Dylan Tell on the show last week felt fairly confident. Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, the, the big shift is that. Yeah. I mean the biggest update for me is that the forward deployed engineer thing is very real and even if the tools can build themselves, there's still so many blockers to actually rolling these out that you're going to need a lot of people inside these organizations who are actually playing with Mac Minis on the weekend and getting obsessed with these tools and then bring them into the enterprise because it's, it's very easy for a lot of people in Fortune 500 companies to just show up and do their job the way they always do it because no one gets fired for switching things up. But if you roll out some tool and it doesn't work the way you intended or it sucks about a bunch of your time even if you're just. I have eight hours of work to do in my traditional system. Where do you get the extra hours to automate your work? It takes time and that's where the Ford deployed engineers come in. So great gig for anyone who wants to go implement enterprise agentic workflows because that will be the theme. Let me tell you about phantom cash. Fund your wallet without exchanges or middlemen and spend with the phantom card. Let's pull up this chart. Andrew Kern over on X pulled it out. We can see Anthropic's run rate revenue growth. You can see here quite the pop from $0 in 2023 to 100 million in Jan of 2024 to a clean 1 billion in Jan 2025 and now sitting at 14 billion. This is acceleration. This is true. Are you feeling it yet? True acceleration. Are you feeling it? Dario sort of underplayed 2027, I guess. Or I guess he said that. He was like I don't think we have another 10x if they go to 100 billion. Well, he said like we've been 10xing. Yeah, you know, we'll see if we do it again. Yeah, like wink wink. But if they, if they hit 140 billion run rate by the end of the year, that would be insane. But strange times, strange times. You love this effect. I mean Tyler's been saying stuff along these lines for some time. So. Okta. Okta helps you assign every AI agent a trusted identity so you get the power of AI without the risk. Secure every agent. Secure any agent. We have a CEO of Optima coming. On the show, pumped for that. Back to the timeline. There are more. There are more. More. In anthropic, Nathan Lambert was quoting their announcement from yesterday saying, we're committing to covering electricity price increases from our data centers. This is anthropic. Oh, yes. To ensure ratepayers aren't picking up the tab will pay 100% of grid upgrade costs, work to bring new power online, and invest in systems to reduce grid strain. Makes so much sense. Yeah. Nathan saying that maybe this should have been their super bowl ad. Yeah. Yeah. It felt like. When you looked at. When you kind of look at clearly how much energy the industry put into the super bowl and what the net effect was for the average American, I don't think any. I don't think the average American came away from that, like, having more positive feelings towards AI. Yeah. If anything, they were like, I'm sick of this stuff. Yeah. Yeah. The meme was like, oh, beer ads, like, refreshing. Yeah, yeah. It would have been good to focus on this. Microsoft did this. What? A couple months ago, the News was on January 14th. So just one month ago, Microsoft announced that they were going to do this because there was a 267% wholesale electricity price near data centers, and local communities were starting to push back. Some $64 billion in projects faced delays or cancellation because of opposition. So it's pretty easy to say, hey, my electricity bill is going up. I don't want a data center in my county, in my city. And you call your city county representative and they say, I don't like the slop either. I see a bunch of junk that doesn't seem that valuable. Why do we need it here? It's not going to create that many jobs. It's not going to be that good for taxes, blah, blah, blah. And other companies that do this too. Google had their clean transition tariff and Amazon also pays a surplus above electricity costs already. But Microsoft was unique because they timed it and did a whole press cycle around their initiative and the volume was much, much higher. The other interesting fact from that previous report was the anti AI issue is remarkably bipartisan. Data Center Watch claims that 55% of Republicans and 45% Democrat in affected districts. So 55, 45. So it's not really like a red right issue or a left issue. Like, there's pushback on both sides. Like when the data center Comes in. It's not just. Oh, it's. It's all green flags in a Republican district. No. Both are pushing back. So. They'Re also going in on. On super PACs. Right. So anthropic is putting $20 million into a super PAC operation that is meant as a direct counter to the OpenAI super PAC operation. The midterms are a battleground between these two rival AI labs, says Teddy Schleffer at the New York Times. And so we're going to see some attack ads. It's like Sam and Dario are running for elections, and we're going to see some. Be the president of AI. Yeah. This person can't restore the economy. What do you think, Tyler? Yeah, but I mean, we just said that, like, overwhelmingly on both sides, there's, like, a lot of pushback. Right. So it's like, what are the actual differences between their approaches? Yeah, that is interesting. Maybe. I guess maybe Anthropic will be more, like, about the China chip issue. Yeah. It feels like they should be more in alliance than against each other. There's a crypto super pac. Yeah. It was, like, the big one. Yeah. There's no, like, big AI one right now. Yeah. Yeah. It would be weird if there was, like, a USDC super PAC and then a USDT super pac, and they were, like, fighting each other and just constantly surfacing bodies that are buried in the closets or skeletons in the closet. Because every time there's a successful attack on OpenAI. Yes. People might be like, oh, okay, I like Anthropic a little bit more. But most. Most people just come away being like, I don't like AI. Yeah. So if they're attacking each other, that could just be bad for both. Maybe. I don't know. But we'll see. We'll see what they run. We'll see what they. Ben over on X says if you were falsely accused of a crime and it went to trial, who would you prefer to listen to the arguments and give the verdict? And the options are a jury of your peers or Claude Opus 4.6. There's been 2,000 votes, and 63% of people prefer for Claude. Yes. Might be the audience here. Yeah. Yeah. A little biased. Ben does work at Orchid Health Engineering whole genome embryo screening, so I wouldn't be surprised if that's his audience. But I don't know. I don't know. I think the jury of your peers will be around for a very, very long time. I think that that will be something. I mean, they still have courtroom stenographers and we have. I think Vlad's gonna be around a long time too. Yeah. Okay. If you're thinking in centuries, maybe, but I mean, the courtroom sketch artist. We've had cameras for 100 years. Like the jury. I'm not saying that I think this will ever happen. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. But you'd prefer it. You would. Ideally. I mean, how many jurors will be sitting there being like, okay, Claude, how should I vote? I haven't really been paying attention. I've been playing Candy Crush. I've been playing. I've been vibe coding my optimal workflow on Cloudbot really quickly. Fin AI, the number one AI agent for customer service. If you want AI to handle your customer support, go to Fin. Will OpenAI or Anthropic IPO first? As of late last year, it was sitting at 75% of people on call. She thought that it would be OpenAI. Now it's flipped. It's flipped. Almost 70% of people think that Anthropic will get out the door. It is narrowing. It is narrowing. But I expect these to kind of fluctuate just with the headlines. It's all red meat for Michael Grimes. I got so many text messages about his move back and being like, it is the most bullish thing for late stage growth technologies that he's back at Morgan Stanley. Like you just like, if you had any doubt that there will be major, major blockbuster iPodS, it's Michael Grimes being back at. So very excited for that really quickly. Gusto. The unified platform for payroll, benefits and HR built to evolve with modern small and medium sized businesses. Taeha over on X says I turned on Meta AI's auto reply for Facebook Marketplace. I listed an item for $75 and when someone asked if it was available, the AI replied asking if they wanted it for free. It's elite. It's all just a bait tactic. So hold on. This is getting community note. Yeah, we got to dig in. It says Meta AI only suggest one reply. So this is a typo in here. Only suggests one reply for every message of the listing. Then you can say edit or say that this one is manually written by the user. So some fake news, but still funny. I mean, taeha's responding. TAEH learned you not trust community notes. This happened to me. No idea why the community note appeared. Meta AI only sends one message. I cannot edit it, but I can unsend it. Omar's catalog. Stop talking trash about it publicly and it might stop giving away your stuff. That's on you, buddy. That's on you Rocco's Basilisko's Basilisk what's up with Warner Brothers? Where did you find console.com first? Console builds AI agents that automate 70% of it, HR and finance support, giving employees instant resolution for access requests and. The situation intensified this week as Paramount CEO David Ellison and a vocal investor made new moves to thwart rival Netflix's planned takeover of the storied Hollywood asset. And the home of Batman, Harry Potter and the White Lotus. Paramount, the long rebuffed suitor for Warner Brothers discovery, enhanced its 77.9 billion all cash offer for the entire company Tuesday in an effort to bring Warner to the negotiating table and ultimately abandoned a seal with Netflix, also an all cash transaction valued at 75 billion. Cleveland investor Ancora holdings entered the fray by acquiring a small stake in Warner with an eye toward increasing its holdings and pressuring the company to negotiate with Paramount. I wonder if they're friends with the Ellisons. Interesting Paramount's gamble. Paramount is hoping its latest pitch can persuade Warner to ditch its agreement and sell its movie and TV studios and HBO Max streaming service to Netflix. Unlike Netflix, Paramount also intends to buy Warner Discovery's cable networks, which include cnn, TBS and Food Network. But Warner has so far shown little interest in engaging with Paramount, telling investors that Ellison's previous offer was not even comparable to the Netflix agreement. On Tuesday, Warner said its board will review Paramount's new offer, but it but isn't modifying its recommendation regarding its agreement with Netflix. The company advised shareholders to not take any action now regarding Paramount's amended tender offer. The bar for Warner to reopen talks with Paramount is very high given its contract with Netflix a massive termination fee. Paramount said it would pay the 2.8 billion give it up for multibillion dollar termination fees Warner would owe Netflix should the agreed to deal collapse and pay a ticking fee of 25 cents a share to Warner shareholders for each quarter its deal hasn't closed. Whoa, we got ticking fees, ticking time bomb. Some stakeholders are holding out for Paramount to further boost its bid. I'm not surprised given that they've repeatedly said with their offers this is not our best and final offer, analyst from Raymond James wrote in a note to clients that many Warner Discovery shareholders still expect Paramount and its backers to raise its $30 a share bid by $2 to $3 a share. So everyone is waiting around saying let's get those numbers up and remind me. Of how Paramount is doing right now. They have ufc, correct, and the experience watching UFC was a downgrade from pay per view but cheaper. What was the takeaway? Well, I mean, I don't think we can like give an analysis of Paramount as an entire business based on the experience was not as good as paying for the pay per view. And was that because you had to, you had to go through all the, you had to jump through all the hoops to sign up for Paramount plus and you weren't already a member? No, the viewing experience was different because it's now subscription and ad supported, whereas previously pay per view had ads, but not nearly as much. So the thing you're missing now watching is like in round commentary, walkouts, things that like hardcore fans really like. Is there less Joe Rogan commentary? Basically brutal. Brutal. Well, the markets are reacting. Paramount's down 7% today. That might be the good day. Of course, not just going on in the market. To this analysis of the UFC viewing experience. Yes, so, but no. The stock dip was apparently in reaction to the breakup fee. People being like, oh great, you're going to pay even more. Yeah. Let me tell you about Applov and profitable advertising made Easy with Axon AI. Get access to over 1 billion daily active users and grow your business today. So for now, Paramount's move Tuesday to sweeten its offer could push Netflix to increase its bid for Warner. Paramount needs to test Netflix's pain threshold without having to bid too high. The revised offer does exactly that without further constraining its balance sheet. For now, the ball is now with Netflix. Warner and Netflix are focusing on getting their deal approved by the Justice Department as well as regulatory authorities in Europe. As part of its investigation, the DOJ is looking into whether Netflix has engaged in anti competitive practices. Last week, President Trump reversed course and said in an interview with NBC News that he didn't think he should weigh in on the deal and would instead leave it to the Justice Department. I've decided I shouldn't be involved. The Justice Department will handle it. Trump said in the interview. He previously expressed concerns about the size and scale of a Netflix Warner combination, saying the combined company would command significant market share. But he's clearly been watching YouTube and he just says YouTube's too dominant. Too many watch hours on YouTube. It's fine, let it rip. That talking point probably worked on him. We'll see. Paramount said. That said we did in talking to Ashley. What was it on Tuesday? Ashley wasn't super excited about having basically one fewer buyer on the documentary side, but he said it was already so cooked that. He was blackpilling hard. If you want some white pills, our newsletter tbpn.com has a list of AI white pills you may have missed. There's a number of them, so go check them out. Digging through the archive, finding basically the vibes on the timeline have been miserable. Everyone's like, you know, fast takeoff, permanent underclass. Tyler Cosgrove is not black pilling. He thinks that we're in the fast takeoff. There's been a lot of white pills. A lot of white pills. Recursive biolabs. They hooked an AI agent up to a biolab. That is a wide open. Yes, no, I agree. I agree. But I understand that a lot of people might see it as a black belt. Erica over on X posted that Eileen Gu to join Benchmark as a senior associate when she returns from the Olympics. She photoshopped this. Of course, we did not put this out, but it's a good bit. Eileen competes for China in the Olympics even though she's a U.S. citizen and an American student. And an American student. Bill Gurley responded, I know a lot of. I know a lot of Americans do this. I have a buddy who was able to go play ping pong in the Olympics because he had dual citizenship or he wasn't even like a dual citizen. He just, like, his parents were from another country. So he was able to go beyond that team because a lot of the other teams are like, way less competitive. So it's like you wouldn't make the US Team, but you want to play anyway. So you go with the other country. But I think with Eileen, it's because the sponsorship dollars she can make by being a Chinese star. Oh, there's all these Chinese brands. I thought you couldn't. She's a global star. You can just get paid. You can get a bunch of it. Not. Not to compete in Olympics, but broader endorsement deal. Yeah. Yeah. You're on the Wheaties box. Getting. Getting a gold medal is like ubi. Yeah. Because you'll be able to do. You'll be turned into a labu. Potentially. Well, yeah. In this case. In this case, yeah. But Bill Gurley actually responded, what do you say? And said, I can't believe you actually found out about this. We were planning to keep it a secret, but he wrote it in Chinese. He's leaning in. He's leaning into the meme. Interesting turn. Post notifications on for when Delian responds. Gurley will be coming on the show. Yes. We're very excited when his new book launches. I have it over there. I don't know how embargoed it is, so I haven't been talking about it. Yet. So we're not gonna share it with you yet. We're very excited. But moving on. We should talk about Public. We should talk about Public. Public is investing for those who take it seriously. Stocks, options, bonds, crypto, treasuries and more with great customer service. We got to talk about amazing ad. That leaf over at Public put together all about teaching kids the power of compound interest. A very different positioning from many other platforms and it was all AI generated. He made it in like two seconds I guess, but it was like still emotional because the idea hit me because I'm a father. But yeah, it's good stuff. Anyway, we got to talk about Higgs Field. Yes, we've had the founder of Higgs Field on the show a couple times. They've been accused of rage bait basically. Yes, I think that's what's going on more than rage bait. But Rashi in Forbes has the daily cover story. Oh wow. All the racist videos and payment problems. The Dark side of this AI startup super fast growth influencer marketing has helped AI company Higsfield hit 300 million in annual in annual revenue run rate in just 11 months. But misleading marketing tactics and a social media strategy based on shock has led to backlash among creators. In late January, Tim Sorritt, a London based video game director, received a message on a social media site from the marketing team at Higsfield, a fast growing AI generation startup. This is the biggest moment in Higsfield history and we want you to to be a part of it, it read. The $1.3 billion startup whose tools are used by some 15 million creators and ad agencies to churn out four and a half million video clips every day, was about to launch a new tool called Vibe Motion, which uses AI models to convert text prompts into motion graphics. You like good vibes, you have motion. Use Vibe Motion. The offer of Sorat shared the startup social media post along with a video clip from pre assembled marketing materials. The company would pay him $200, but Zorit, who has spent years designing graphics both manually and with AI tools, could tell something was off. Videos Higsfield had shared with him lacked the visual quirks of AI. He's like this is simply too good. Interesting. And he quickly realized that some clips in the media kit weren't generated with AI at all. I said this was a huge alpha in just taking a cinema camera, filming yourself and being like this is AI generated and I'm raising it's fraud. But alpha, that's not alpha. Don't do it, don't do it. But there was a moment, I mean this happens a lot with OpenAI stuff where people will see a video and they'll be like, wow, they definitely have a new model. And it's like they also have a production budget. They can just hire actors. Well, so when Sam Blonde launched Monaco yesterday, was his video AI? Because it looked. It was 5050 for me. Yeah, there's definitely. I think you would just rip a direct account. Oh, I know you obviously could, but clearly the models are good enough where you could. And it's kind of a funny thing if you're launching an AI company to show why not. I made this with AI. Is that good? Good enough. Anyways, so they get this guy gets a media kit, says hey, can you share some of these outputs? But he found out and said they were video templates that appear to have been lifted from a stock site in Vato. And when it pasted its own logos, while Sort didn't share the videos, others did, circulating the stock video templates on X to promote Higsfield. Wow, all this hype is fake and it's bought. Sora told Forbes. Bixfield's co founder and chief strategy officer Mahi told Forbes the media kit was created by an employee in the startup's marketing team for ideation purposes and was inadvertently shared with creators, saying the company's processes went haywire. With its library of 400 presets of camera motions and visual effects, SF based Higgs field offers an easy way for creators and advertisers to produce cinematic short videos through text based prompts. You guys already know this, mahi says. We fully admit that we pushed the envelope. We learned from what works on platforms like X, and very explicitly it's more controversial content that gets attention. So that's translated into hockey stick revenue growth. Last month, the startup claimed it doubled its annualized revenue to 200 million in just two weeks, driven largely by subscriptions from its 300,000 paying users. By early February, its annual run rate crossed 300 million. CEO Alex told Forbes that he hopes to reach 1 billion by the end of the year. After raising 80 million from firms like Excel and Menlo in mid January, the startup is now in talks to raise funding again. But that rapid growth appears to be driven by aggressive, shocking and sometimes misleading marketing tactics. Anyways, they're moving very quickly. It was interesting when we asked Alex about his margins, he seemed kind of, he gave kind of a concerning response. He immediately was like, yeah, well, when. You'Re reselling a model, you are at risk there at the Same time with a different business model, with a different customer acquisition flow. It's possible to have good margins on top of models if it's deeply embedded. But I've actually been getting served a whole bunch of Higgs Field, spawncon or like how to videos that are amazing. A lot of them are testaments to the power of the underlying models. Like nanobanana. I saw there's this cool video where this creator was talking about how hard it is to film yourself. Like, let's say you want to do one of those cool, like I'm locked in videos, which I really enjoy. And you want the camera to be here getting a profile shot of you and then flip around, go behind you, over your shoulder, then spin around, show your face, then go inside the keyboard. That can be a really, really hard shot to get. You might need like a automated camera or robot. Like you need a Kuka robot arm to do that move. MKBHD has one, but they're very, very expensive. Hundreds of thousands of dollars. Not every creator can afford one. And so he was basically showing this workflow where he will film himself on a tripod here. Move the tripod, move the tripod, move the tripod and then put in the start and end frames into nanobananapro and then it interpolates those and does the sweeping move. And because it's all in motion, there's motion blur and it has two reference frames of like Jordy's side and then Jordi's back. It actually looks perfect and it doesn't need to come up with as much imagination. So it delivers really well. And a lot of those have been sort of those like little like fun, like tools or like workflows have been promoted by influencers and they'll say like comment and I'll send you the prompts or I'll send you the workflow or I'll break it down or I have a course or something like that info products on top of these things. And I haven't really jumped in, but I've seen those and been like, I would love to make that video of me or my dog or whatever, my car. It's a fun thing and for the right person that's going to actually work as a marketing ad or work as content for them really quick. Let me tell you about 11 labs. Build intelligent real time conversational agents. Reimagine human technology interaction with 11 labs. Also, I got to tell you about 11 reader because I used it this morning in the car to read or dictate the will menaitis essay and I really enjoyed it. So shout out 11 reader. Can it do Will's voice yet? No, we should get Will to license his voice. We really should. Well, the author, I had the option. To pick a few different voices. You can clone your own voice, but you can't clone someone else's yet because it makes you read like certain text. So the iconic voice collection, it serves to you and says, do you want to do Michael Caine, who's a British icon? Burt Reynolds, the masculine iconic storyteller. Richard Feynman, Raw genius. Sir Laurence Olivier and Dr. Maya Angelou. And I picked Burt Reynolds, the masculine iconic storyteller. So he led me here's maybe where Higgs Field kind of crossed the line. Apparently they shared. They were sharing a Google Drive folder with creators that had popular children's characters like Shrek, Moana and Mickey Mouse saying things that are on the show but sound a little, a little racist and then non consensual deepfakes of public figures like Sydney Sweeney and Zendaya and President Trump. So yeah, the challenge here is like companies like Hitfilm, Higsfield are competing with these Chinese open source models that have no rules. They'll generate whatever you want. And clearly there's an insane amount of demand for video models that have no rules, of course. And so this isn't surprising, even though it's wrong. Yeah, it's. I mean, it goes Back to the BitTorrent Napster analogy where like the demand for things that just can't be done legally is really, really high and you have to, you can't view that as a business opportunity because of course you'll see really, really high demand for completely free music if you're not paying anything. Right. You'll see really high demand for generate Mickey Mouse character. The question is, the business question is can you actually do the deal, license it, make sure all the stakeholders and all the legal parties are represented and happy with the deal and everyone's paying. If you're just throwing out free IP violation, you're going to see huge demand, but it's probably unsustainable. Yeah. So they did launch a program called Higsfield Earn, which was basically like a clipping thing. You could make stuff, share it, depending on how much engagement it got. You earned some money that led to them getting banned from X for their account shut down. Whoa, I didn't realize that. So, yeah, we'll see how this nets out. Alex, I'm sure will, I would hope, would adjust course. Yeah, he is. They're clearly very talented at A lot of things, but it sounds like they've been blurring the line. I mean, for what it's worth, I still think that I don't know how fast you would get steamrolled by the labs, but I do think that there's an interesting opportunity right now for like little bit of what Capcut's doing. Plus nanobanana Sora stuff where you have a lot of video generation but then you also have the ability to lay over just actual text, actual motion graphics. And if you pair up some of the more deterministic tools, like basically tool use, like how, how ChatGPT can also do a math problem in python and be 100% accurate. You could imagine if you, if you want to just draw a rectangle on top of the video that you've generated or make it black and white, that's something that doesn't require a generative AI model. You can just call a tool that has the same functionality as Premiere Pro and then it'll just do that. But you have to actually wire all that up, make it all work together and maybe that's where this goes and then I don't really know how defensible that is, but we'll see. Yeah, I was just gonna say like, I mean you're kind of just describing like a wrapper, right? Yeah. At least in the text field, like it seems like rappers, at least of late, like have not been. Yeah. You know, people are much less bullish on rappers now than they were like a year and a half ago. Yeah, especially the huge problem. I don't know. Sdkid. Pretty good. Yeah, I like that. Let me tell you about Lambda Lambda is the super intelligence cloud building AI supercomputers for training and inference at scale from one GPU to hundreds of thousands. The other really hard thing about the video wrapper, the video app, is that many, many video producers, they start fresh every day. When we edit Diet TVPN, our 30 minute cut down of the show, the project is started from basically a clean slate. And so actually shifting from one software to another is really, really easy. I mean you still, to learn the new tool, it has to be better, it has to have all the features. But it's not like, okay, well there's all these networks of documents, there's a system of record, it's different. If you're editing a movie over two years, you're probably not going to switch tools mid movie. But if you're a shorts editor, you can switch from Capcut to Instagram edits like their video edit editing tool really quickly. You can go over to After Effects or Premiere and you can just be like, for this video, we're using this. This happens to us all the time. Like we'll have a video editor on the team who's like, oh yeah, they use DaVinci Resolve and it's like, it doesn't even matter to us because it's like, oh yeah, they just use that and then they plug in and then they deliver a video file. At the end they render it out. Anyway. One more thing on Higgs Field, I would expect that Disney comes after them too. They're generating Disney characters right now. Disney invested a billion dollars into OpenAI as part of this licensing deal. One year exclusive. There's they. I would expect that pressure to come soon. Let's move over to Bill Ackman, but first let me tell you about Shopify. Shopify is the e commerce platform that grows with your business and lets you sell in seconds online, in store, on mobile, on social, on marketplaces. And now with AI agents, Bill Ackman. Makes a big bet on Meta Pershing Square disclosed roughly $2 billion position in Meta Hedge Fund manager Bill Ackman likes Mark Zuckerberg's chances in AI. Pershing Square revealed the stake at an annual meeting of one of its fund on Wednesday. The position amounted to 10% of the firm's capital at the end of 2025, or roughly 2 billion based on past disclosures. Meta shares are down about 13% over the past six months, a decline that Pershing Square attributes to investor concerns about the sums the company is spending on AI Capex. Pershing's thesis revolves in part around AI boosting Meta's content recommendation and personalized ads and potentially unlocking new opportunities and wearables or AI digital assistants for businesses. Ben Thompson Keep reading. I'm going to pull up Meta's business. Model is one of the clearest beneficiaries of AI integration, Pershing Square said in its presentation. Ackman tends to concentrate his stock portfolio in a small number of high conviction bets. He only had 13 different positions at the end of 2025, including other big tech companies, Alphabet and Amazon. What did you say? You disliked me for real? You co tweeted this, right? Yeah, there's a. I mean I didn't like really add anything. I just posted a Jeremy Giffon, you. Created this post and you photoshopped Jeremy's name on there because it was your idea. It came from you. What did Jeremy say? I just want to give him credit. He said the Idea that it's hard to beat the market is mostly trotted out by money managers. What they really mean is that it's hard to do when you manage other people's money because it's difficult to get paid for doing the obvious thing. I think it's substantially easier than most people think for the person solely running their own cash. So ackman is charging 2 and 20 to own the Mag 7. You love to see it, but a lot of people don't have diamond hands. He will diamond hands for you by holding Alphabet, Amazon and Meta, apparently. Let me tell you about Railway. Railway is the all in one intelligent cloud provider. Use your favorite agent to deploy web apps, servers, databases and more. While Railway takes automatically takes care of scaling, speaking security. Speaking of meta, Ray Ban maker Luxottica says it more than tripled Meta AI glasses sales in 2025. Take off. The French Italian eyewear brand said it sold over 7 million AI glasses last year, up from 2 million that the company sold in 2023 and 2024 combined. Wait, so, so sorry, say that number again. How many did they sell last year? 7 million devices last year. I think I'm starting to see them. I mean Ashlee Vance came on the show and was wearing them for fun, but also for good content. He's gonna actually include that content in the stuff that he makes. It's a video makers tool, so it's a prosumer tool. He of course had a whole bunch of other nice cameras here, but that is another tool that you can't really replace. He doesn't want a GoPro strapped to his head. That doesn't make any sense. Then you have the extreme sports. I'm going skiing in a couple weeks with a bunch of friends. I'm sure I'll see couple a, a pair of the vanguards out there on the slopes. And then you just have the funny people on Instagram reels saying, computer, give this guy a great day. That comedy is great. Did you see that? That guy ran into another creator that was doing this yelling at him. Yeah, yeah, computer, computer, give this guy a bust down. Ap. Something like that. It was just like very, very funny. And every time I see one on a truly viral Instagram reel, I'm like, okay, there's something here that, that's unlocking a different form of video. Not unlike when we saw the first GoPro go out and we started seeing truly crazy first person video of surfing, which was just impossible. Or like I made. I would go surfing. Speaking of surfing, I went surfing with Rocco Basilisco, Rocco's Basilisk, the Luxottica exec and Air led the project with Meta. He took out a new pair of the Oakleys and we did lose them briefly, but we recovered them. They need Meta Croquis, right? Isn't that what they're called? Didn't have Croakies. Yeah, you need the Meta Croakies. Let's get on that, Zuck. But anyways, Bloomberg reported that Meta and Luxottica were discussing doubling production to at least 20 million by the end of this year to meet growing demand. So I think they're gonna be. They're selling. They're selling. Yeah. Give them credit. Give. Give Zuck some credit. And again, I saw somebody had effectively jailbroken their Meta Ray Bans and they hooked it up to a Mac Mini and they were buying stuff. I've talked about this at least once on the show, but again, there's. That's funny to watch somebody jailbreak a device to do something that the device will obviously do, like in the relative near term. That's like the part of the entire thesis behind the device. But. Yeah. Well, I mean, I don't know. Will it actually tell you when you get an imessage in the next three years? Is that coming? I don't know. It might not. Those walled gardens might hold for a while. Do you think the Meta Ray Bans will outsell sunglasses broadly? Or is the TAM sunglass buyers? Everyone has one pair of sunglasses, so you sell one pair of these to all the people, or is it. And some people just don't like sunglasses so they don't wear them, or are they like TAM expanding in some way? They've got to be. That's a good question. Yeah. And I will give you assume the next version beyond that is like truly indistinguishable. Yeah. So my framework has been that the immediate market of people, over a billion people that just wear glasses daily so that they can read, feels extremely in reach. Right. Because you're wearing this all day long. Why not add some functionality to it? Totally. Certainly there'll be some Luddites that just want the analog magic of just a pair of plastic with some glasses in it. But. But then, yeah, I don't know. I've never. It's funny, I love the way sunglasses look, but I've never been a sunglasses guy. I just don't really. I don't. I rarely, rarely wear them. I still once or twice a year will buy a pair because they look cool. And then I don't actually end up wearing them. I like sunglasses when it's bright out. I just like the functionality of them. But I do lose them constantly, so. Oh, you're one of those guys. Yeah, I'm a sunglass loser. But the question is like if you comp to the Apple watch, it feels like more people are wearing watches than before the Apple watch. Because watches were sort of like a niche. You had to be into watches to wear one because everyone had the phone in their pocket and they were like, why do I need a watch? And then once the Apple watch came out, a lot of people were like, well, I want a super watch on my wrist. I want a computer on my wrist. I want the iPhone computer. Bust down Apple watch. I think we're onto something. They're doing orange, they're doing Hermes orange. They're selling very well in China. The bust down, they did the gold, it was $10,000. Do you remember this? And it flops, right? The Apple watch edition, it was $10,000 gold plated, solid gold, something like that. I don't know if it flopped. They did discontinue it, but it getting. Roasted in the chat. I like sunglasses when it's brighter. Jordy doesn't like sunglasses when it's brighter. That's a hot take. That's a bold statement, heavy hitting analysis. But I like the idea of the bust down Apple Watch. Get it at 100k? The problem with the gold Apple watch was that you buy this thing for $10,000 and it immediately loses all its value because it doesn't even run the latest software and it just stops working after like five years, which is ridiculous. Like if you buy. If you're spending $10,000 on a watch, you want it to be useful in 100 years. Years. You want it to be around for a long time. But should we read through Jeremy's actual response? Oh, did he post again? Because I read his. Oh, oh, okay. So he did talk about this really quickly. Label Box, RL environments, Voice robotics, evals and expert human data. Label Box is the data factory behind the world's leading AI teams. And yes, Jeremy says responding to Ackman charging 2 and 20 to own the Mag 7. He owns Google, Amazon and Meta. He he says this is good capital allocation, but it requires permanent capital. People don't actually want the best returns. They want to feel clever and do some like weird little thing that makes them feel interesting or different or something. But sometimes you just got to do the obvious thing and just be really strong on it. I always admire those managers who have been paid 2 and 20 for, like, 40 years to just own Berkshire. It's awesome because they were right, but they were. And they were providing a service. The service is that the LP does not have the personal confidence to own Berkshire on their own. So they actually need to pay a huge premium for someone else to give them the confidence to own Berkshire. It's just a tax that they pay for not having the conviction to do it themselves. And I think that that's great and solves a real problem for a lot of people. I love it. Well said. Let me tell you about CrowdStrike. Your business is AI. Their business is securing it. CrowdStrike secures AI and stops breaches. We got one more post before we bring in our first guest. We can pull this up. People are reacting to the men's luge doubles. They're saying it's one of the most baffling things I've ever watched. And national champion speaker says, how do you find out you're good at this? What's the conversation look like? I really want to know. I didn't know this doubles. I guess I may have seen this before. I remember as a kid watching singles. But this is baffling. There's also something called scout. Like, what are you. What do you. I think it's an evolution. I think it starts with, like, a toboggan, and you have, like, a bunch of people essentially in, like, a rowboat, you know, in like a long. Like, if you're doing crew, you have like four or five people, and then you're just like, let's do one less, let's do one less. Let's optimize and reduce weight. And then they're finally down to just two people, and they're basically just on this, like, sled together. And, yeah, I guess you get here, but very, very funny. What else is going on in the Olympics? Personal injury attorney in his 50s is on the cusp of becoming the oldest American Winter Olympian in history. All he needs is for one of his teammates to slip and fall. This guy is elite. Remember the last Olympics where there was that great meme that came out where it was like, the one person with, like, all the gear and all this other stuff, and then the random guy, I think, from Turkey who just showed up and was just like. And just like, was. I think he won the gold or something. I don't know. That might have been too poetic. But modest proposals. It's an incredible feel like being a personal injury attorney is probably a great gig if you're in one of these kind of fringe Olympic sports, you know, you want to have some flexibility in your schedule. You want to be able to make enough to reinvest into the sport. This guy's clearly locked in. This guy is amazing. Okay, so Rich ruhonen is a 54 year old personal injury attorney who plays an indispensable role for the US Curling team. He cooks the players omelets before important matches and grills steaks after huge wins. He handles the early morning grocery shopping so they can sleep in. What a team player. He chauffeurs them around in a rental minivan. He even pays for some of their flights and hotel rooms. But those aren't his only jobs. He is also the most unlikely curler at the Milan Cortina Games, where he could become the oldest American athlete in Winter Olympics history. And just in case people don't believe that someone nearing retirement age could possibly be an Olympic athlete, Ruhonen answers the question on a homemade T shirt. I'm not the dad and I'm not the coach, he says. But he is an American curling legend. Ruhonen first appeared in the national champion tournament in 1998. He's been doing it for overnight 20 years, maybe won it a decade later, and has been a fixture in the sport since long before any of his teammates were born. What he had never done was curl under the sport's brightest lights. Rohonen just missed qualifying for the Olympics several times. His most recent heartbreak came before the 2020 Olympic Games when the US trials mixed in doubles. 2022. 2022. Sorry. When the US trials mixed in mixed doubles came down to the last shot, Rohonen decided to focus on his law practice in the senior circuit. At 50, he finally gave up on his Olympic aspirations. I honestly thought it was over four years ago, he said. Well, I probably thought it was over eight years before that. Then he got an unexpected call. He's back. The captain for one of the nation's up and coming teams was battling a rare autoimmune disease and needed a substitute. On paper, the Gen Xer wasn't the most natural fit. The other curlers were all in their mid-20s, roughly the same age as Ronan's children. He even has a few decades on Team USA's coach. Few decades, but on ice, he blended right in. So when skip Danny Casper recovered from his illness in return, Rohonen stuck around as the alternate team. Casper then qualified for the Olympics and became Team usa. Rohonen says throwing the rock at the Olympics would be the single greatest moment of his entire life. Rock. My kids know it and my wife knows it. I'm going to start using. I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going to put on curling at home and just start using some of the hardcore terminology. Yeah, just be like, ah, I can't, I can't that. You know, that happened a couple decades ago because on cnbc, which all the hedge funds watch after the market closed, they would just roll over to NBC coverage when the two, when the two companies were together and they would show curling just because of the time change. That's what was on. And so all these Wall street guys became obsessed with curling, got really into it, started placing bets and stuff. It's a fun story. Yeah. I wonder how big is the gambling and sports betting around the Olympics? I don't know. I saw some numbers for the Super Bowl. It was really, really big. But you have to imagine that the Olympics is also huge. While you look that up, let me tell you about Turbo Puffer. Serverless vector in full text search built from first principles and object storage. Fast 10x cheaper and extremely scalable. And our next guest is here so we can, can come back to Olympics coverage after. But let's bring in Brian Johnson to the TVPN ultradome. I will tell you about Vibe co while he walks in where DTC companies, B2B startups and AI companies advertise on streaming TV, pick channels, target audiences and measure sales just like on Meta. And you might be doing some advertising soon because there's a huge launch. How are you doing? Hey, I brought you guys a gift. Thank you. What'd you bring? Are we doing shots? We're doing shots. Amazing. Here we go. Amazing. Yeah. Okay. Have you done a shot of olive oil? I haven't take out our done. I've never done a shot of olive oil. What are the benefits? Break it down. Why would I do this? I like olive oil on a steak. Yeah, I mean, have you. Is olive oil a part of your life? Only in the cooking context. Yeah, but I should just be drinking it. Nothing shots yet? No. What? Yeah. What are the benefits? And what is this? Did you grow the olives? Is it cold pressed? Just this much. Should we not. Should we not do a little bit more? No, no, no, no, no. This is live TV. 15 milliliters. This is live TV. Yeah, this is the precise still. 15 milliliters. 15 milliliters. One tablespoon. Okay. What's this gonna do for you? It's the. I think it's the superfood. Of superfoods. Okay, it does. I mean, just like you look down the list of things. It does. Okay. It's just good for almost everything. Okay. So is it high calorie? How many calories? 120. 130 calories in this. Okay. Calories don't scare you, though? No, I mean, it's 15% of my daily caloric intake. I consume more olive oil than any food. Ye. Like shots. Is that roughly. So 45. So three tablespoons a day. 45 milliliters. Three shots a day. Okay, so one with every meal? One with every meal. Okay. Well, cheers. Cheers. To Brian Johnson. Blueprint. Cheers. Down the hatch. Delicious. That is good. Smooth. Very smooth. No problem. I could do that. No, bite. A little bit of bite. And so I just drank 15 milliliters of olive oil. And I'm going to live forever now, right? Basically. So now I can go back to diet. One shot it. And nicotine. One shot it. Steaks, right? Yeah. Do you feel the sting now? A little bit. I do. I do. Like a little cough bubbling up. Yeah, yeah. Perfect for broadcasting. Yeah, yeah, that's. It's a good sign of a good olive oil. So we source this in both hemispheres so it's always fresh. Okay. So it comes off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Where? Yeah, Where? More specifically, this one. Some chili. Chili. And the brand is called snake oil. That's right. Funny. How does this fit into the overall.
The platform and do the exploration. Hi, Bar. I want to run through kind of a lightning round of questions. What have you learned from Ray Pete? That there's a lot of Ray Peters on X. Yeah. And they really want you to follow their. Yeah, they do. They want you to Pete out. They do, yeah. So they're definitely evangelists. So Ray Pete has a lot of evangelists. Carrots. Underrated. Overrated. Yeah. Carrots are a great food. You know, they, they're, they're not benign. Like, no food is benign. It has. Yeah. Pros and cons. What else? If, where would you live if you weren't a public figure and you could just optimize for health? Yeah. You know, Kate's here. Hey, Kate. Hey, Kate. Yeah, we were just having this conversation. She's from Australia. We were just having this conversation, trying to figure that out. It's really an interesting question. LA is certainly not the place if you're purely optimizing for health. Yeah, yeah, that's very true. So it has been top of mind for us and we are trying to figure out if we did something next level, where would we go and how we do it. I wouldn't have an answer yet. Yeah, yeah. I think it's an important question. There's data on golf courses. I don't know if you've seen this. I have. If you live near a golf course, like, reduces your life expectancy. Expectancy. Because they use such heavy pesticides. On the golf course. Because how close to the golf course? There's one in my town that's probably not great. These studies were done on like people that live in like a golf. Oh, like. Right. So like you're living on the golf course and they're, they're basically, you know, golfers just want it to look pretty. They're not asking like, hey, what did you do to make it look so pretty realistic. How are you? What are your long term kind of concerns around the health of us being in this studio? Rubber smell. Yeah. You smell it? Yes. So that is. I think it's these things. Honestly, I love that question so much. I would love. And I've. And I've thought about it a lot and I would love to work on this because like we have an LED light right here. I don't know about these lights. Maybe you can consult on our next. On our next. Honestly, we're moving soon, so I would. Love to come in here and do a comprehensive analysis. Oh my God, it would be so good. No, the air, the air quality. I mean, we spent a Lot of time in here. Yeah. And we plan to spend. Brian's going to come back and say you guys have 10, like 10 years, like 9, 8, 7. I mean first of all your CO2 levels for sure are too high. Sure. I can fill the CO2, right. Kate, do you feel the CO2? Yeah. You need a CO2 meter for sure. Yeah. So the space is too small. Yeah, I have the meter in my house. I'll move around to the different rooms to kind of track it. And I've got a whole like I've done a bunch of work to the H VAC system and see over a. Thousand is going to impair your thinking total. Yeah. So but that's obvious. You watch it like you're like these. Guys takes like I like sunglasses right now. What do you think? How are you thinking about parasites? There's tons of health influencers that will make parasites their whole thing and that like every, the solution to every problem is like got to fix the parasites. Yeah. How are you thinking about them? We. I've not done a deep dive into that. I don't know. So these are people who have parasites and they're trying to get rid of them. The argument is everyone has them. Some amount are probably helpful because they'll eat heavy metals and then you'll eventually kind of release them, things like that. But you should do a deep dive on that. Yep. Do you think how do you cycle supplements? Right now I'm taking L, theanine, glycine and a number of other things before bed. It's been super effective at getting REM and deep sleep up for me. But I'm curious when you find a supplement that is working and it's like measured in my case, how should you cycle it? How do you think about cycling it to make sure that you continue to get the benefit? Yeah. This is one of the questions we're asking in the inference engine is because we've done a whole bunch of these different cycles and it's difficult because it's never truly a non confounded experiment. There's always some confoundation and so when you're trying to tease out little tiny signal you do need to be robust about the analysis. So we don't know like we have like some short term data on that but not strong enough that I think I'd express an opinion. So we're hopeful that the bigger data sets will give us insight. Same kind of question on fasting. I've started. I inverted the fasting schedule because we do the show. We'll have like a big breakfast at 8am I'll have a second meal at around 2:30 and then I won't eat until the next day at 8am so typically somebody might start eating at 12 have another meal around dinner and then wait until the next day So I flipped it Any learnings from that? Personally the marker I would look for. That probably is and to be clear part of the reason is I actually there's a functional reason which is that the way that we do the show I need to be like powered up fueled up to then podcast for three hours. Yeah but then I also don't like being having a big dinner and going to bed. Yeah yeah. You guys work out in the morning together. Yeah yeah. 6:30 at 6:30 huge meal. Huge meal at 888 to 9. Yeah. Anyway thank you so much for coming on the show. This is fantastic. Lots more to talk about. Yeah we can go all night all day. Let me tell you about MongoDB.
Then what can people do at $100,000 a year? And then I want to hear about the million dollar a year, all in plan. Well, we announced that today, so it's called Immortals. Immortals. A million dollars a year. And it's my exact protocol. It's your exact protocol. My doctors, my concierge team, all the testing infrastructure. So blood work, too. Everything. Every test, every therapy. And so it's. I mean, this has been really hard to build because it hasn't existed. So we just had to scour the evidence, build out the infrastructure globally. And. And this is basically when someone says, getting enough feedback? Let's turn that speaker off. Sorry. We're working on bringing the soundboard to life in the TVP and ultradome. Sorry. Continue. Yeah, so the. I guess, like, if you look at a few. Three different frames, like one is, we measure probably around 250 to 300 things that kill me. That will kill you. Actively. That actively kill you. Everything in the gas station. Yes. Basically. I mean, everything in the modern world. Yes. And so if you look at it from, like, don't die. Okay, so what things actually cause you to die? And then if you look at it from the positive things of what makes you live, that list is probably like 250 things that kill you and 250 things that make you live well. And if you take on that burden as an individual, to say, I want to do all of these things that make me avoid the things that make me die and do the things that do make me live, well, that's like a herculean task. So this program basically takes all of those things, makes it easy. So you just show up. It's like, what do I do? And the system tells you what to do. Yeah. What is the. What does the program look like more specifically? Like, what. How. How is start? It's very. It's very. So you're doing three people, right? Yeah. Three thoughts, three to start. What do their weeks, months, year look like? So we'll do first? It depends on who the person is. We have an interview process because the person needs to be willing to work. Yeah. You can't just, like, show up and, like, give me a pill. You have to put in. Probably around like, I was promised immortality with a single shot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you're telling me that's why it's called snake oil? Yeah. You got the best. So we have an interview process. We'll make sure the person's willing to put in the work, that they've got a pain tolerance, you know, they can like, you know, like they have to be willing to do stuff. You know, sometimes therapies hurt, sometimes it hurts to be hungry. Sometimes like, so there's some discomfort and, and then they will choose the three people and then we'll do a comprehensive baseline. So for me, over the past five years, we were counting yesterday, we have a few billion data points on me over the past five years. That's a lot. And so then if you say what of those few billion data points are usable? Probably a few hundred million, but still we have a few hundred million data points. And so what we've done is to date, I guess like years ago that existed in spreadsheets and files. We've now set up an AI system where we take all the context and now we have this inference engine to say like, what relationships can you find in all this data? And so what we're building is an AI, a Brian AI that basically watches after you 24 7. So you start, you do a whole bunch of comprehensive baselines where you're at in the world and then we start doing targeted protocols like how do you isolate cardiovascular health and how do you look at so on and so forth. Then you're going to find issues as well where the person may have a surprise finding. How do you address that? They'll have some anomaly. So then we just get after it and we just say like, how do you basically take the baseline measurements and make all of them better? Yeah. Do you want these people to be local? Can they be anywhere? Anywhere? Are they all over the world or US based? Is there advances? We're open. Open to everything. Okay, interesting. How, how are you thinking about AI? When I think about a product like snake oil, I think not a lot of AI.
Going on in the Olympics. Personal injury attorney in his 50s is on the cusp of becoming the oldest American Winter Olympian in history. All he needs is for one of his teammates to slip and fall. This guy is elite. Remember the last Olympics where there was that great meme that came out where it was like the one person with all the gear and all this other stuff and then the random guy, I think, from Turkey who just showed up and was just like. And just was. I think he won the gold. Something. I don't know, that might have been too poetic. But Modest Proposal says it's an incredible. Being a personal injury attorney is probably a great gig if you're in one of these kind of fringe Olympic sports. You know, you want to have some flexibility in your schedule. You want to be able to make enough to reinvest into the sport. Yeah, this guy's clearly locked in. This guy is amazing. Okay, so Rich ruhonen is a 54 year old personal injury attorney who plays an indispensable role for the US Curling team. He cooks the players omelets before important matches and grills steaks. And after huge wins, he handles the early morning grocery shopping so they can sleep in. What a team player. He chauffeurs them around in a rental minivan. He even pays for some of their flights and hotel rooms. But those aren't his only jobs. He is also the most unlikely curler at the Milan Cortina Games, where he could become the oldest American athlete in Winter Olympics history. And just in case people don't believe that someone nearing retirement age could possibly be an Olympic athlete, Rouhonen answers the question on a homemade T shirt. I'm not the dad and I'm not the coach, he says. But he is an American curling legend. Ruhonen first appeared in the national champion tournament in 1998. He's been doing it for overnight, 20 years, maybe won it a decade later, and has been a fixture in the sport since long before any of his teammates were born. What he had never done was curl under the sport's brightest lights. Rohonen just missed qualifying for the Olympics several times. His most recent heartbreak came before the 2020 Olympic Games when the US trials mixed in doubles. 2022. 2022. Sorry. When the US trials mixed in mixed doubles came down to the last shot, where Honan decided to focus on his law practice in the senior circuit. At 50, he finally gave up on his Olympic aspirations. I honestly thought it was over four years ago, he said. Well, I probably thought it was over eight years before that. Then he got an unexpected call. He's back. The captain for one of the nation's up and coming teams was battling a rare autoimmune disease and needed a substitute. On the Gen Xer wasn't the most natural fit. The other curlers were all in their mid-20s, roughly the same age as Ronan's children. He even has a few decades on Team USA's coach. Few decades, but on ice, he blended right in. So when skip Danny Casper recovered from his illness in return, Rohonen stuck around as the alternate Team Casper then qualified for the Olympics and became Team usa. Ronan says throwing the rock at the Olympics would be the single greatest moment of his entire life. Rock. My kids know it and my wife knows it. I'm going to start using. I'm going to.
District. No. Both are pushing back. So. They'Re also. Going in on. On super PACs. Right. So anthropic is putting $20 million into a super PAC operation that is meant as a direct counter to the OpenAI super PAC operation. The midterms are a battleground between these two rival AI Labs, says Teddy Schleffer at the New York Times. And so we're going to see some attack ads. It's like Sam and Dario are running for election, and we're going to see some. Be the president. AI. Yeah. This person can't. Can't restore the economy. What do you think, Tyler? Yeah, but I mean, we just said that, like, that overwhelmingly on both sides, there's, like, a lot of pushback. Right. So it's like, what are the actual differences between their. Their approaches? Yeah, that is interesting. Maybe. I guess maybe Anthropic will be more, like, about the China chip issue. Yeah. It feels like there's. They should be more in alliance than against each other. Yeah. There's a crypto super pac. Yeah. It's like the big one. Yeah. There's no, like, big AI one right now. Yeah. Yeah. It would be weird if there was, like, a USDC super pack and then a USDT super pac, and they were, like, fighting each other and just constantly surfacing bodies that are buried in the closets or skeletons in the closet. Because every time there's a successful attack on OpenAI. Yes, people might be like, okay, I like Anthropic a little bit more. But most. Most people will just come away and be like, I don't like AI. Yeah. So if they're attacking each other, that could just be bad for both. Maybe. I don't know. But we'll see. We'll see what they run. We'll. Find out. We'll see what they. Ben over on X says if you were falsely accused of a crime and it went to trial, who would you prefer to listen to the arguments and give the verdict?
That's like the first thing that I. Want from a product, honestly. Yeah. What a blind spot we had. We should have picked that one up. Yes. How are you processing the looks maxing virality that's going on? It feels like very tangential. In some ways there's some overlap. I've seen the looks maxers say don't worry about the macros or the micronutrients or the toxins at all. All that matters is how much protein you're getting. Because they have a very live fast, die young. But there's still some overlap in that they're trying to look good. We've talked about this before. Well, yeah, in many ways I feel like you've been, you've been looks maxing. You wouldn't necessarily call it that. But you can just see every now and then a photo will go viral where it's like you every six months. And people are like, wait, it's working. So in some ways it's kind of marketing. There's a lot of work kind of under the surface that's contributing to that. But at the same time it's very clear, like people want you to look better every month or they're gonna say like, hey, can I really trust this guy? Yeah. I mean, there's two things. One is like you guys, your disposition towards advertising. It's like, yes. And if someone's out there doing their thing, more power to them. And whatever their jam is, if they're doing look smacking, do your art and be beautiful. That's great. And so yeah, I'm very much a proponent of let humans be beautiful in their manifestation. We're basically, we're saying that as we all realize something's happening in the world right now, it's big with AI in some form or fashion, it's evolving the world. And our primary hypothesis is as this evolves, the major shift is humans are going to want life. If AI takes our jobs or they take what we do and we want to find new identity, there's going to be a major shift towards don't die. And it's going to become probably the most dominant ideology in the world very quickly because we're gonna be pointing ourselves towards vibrancy. That is an interesting encapsulation because it does feel a little bit like the two paths meme with the dark castle and the bright palace in the sense that a lot of the looks maxers are saying they're black pilled. They don't believe that there will be a future. So health actually takes a backseat to looks because that's what helps you get ahead this year, this month. And it's very short termism. Very short term thinking. You've always framed it from one around very long term thinking. So even though I think people might say, oh, well, like, he's trying to look good, that guy's trying to look good, they're similar, there's actually a huge divergence in the philosophy. At least it feels like that. I don't know. Jordy, what do you think? I had another question. Please take it. So you have this. You're starting with the ultra pretty.
So it's just very, very hard to create an isolated non toxic. So there's lots of toxins at risk out in the real world. Talk about other risks in the real world. Have you ever been frame mogged? Sure, people have tried. You know what? That is so good. We should put that on the list. That escaped our For a million bucks, you've got to protect me from frame logging. That's. Like the first thing that I want from a product. Honestly. Yeah. What a blind spot we had. We should have picked that one up. Yes. How are you processing?
Hi, Bar. I want to run through kind of a lightning round of questions. What have you learned from Ray Pete? That there's a lot of Ray Peters on X. Yeah. And they really want you to follow their. Yeah, they do. They want you to Pete out. They do, yeah. So they're definitely evangelists. So Ray Pete has a lot of evangelists. Carrots. Underrated. Overrated. Yeah. Carrots are great food. They're not benign. Like, no food is benign. It has pros and cons. What else you got? Jordy, where would you live if you weren't a public figure and you could just optimize for health? Yeah. You know, Kate's here. Hey, Kate. Hey, Kate. Yeah, we were just having this conversation. She's from Australia. We were just having this conversation, trying to figure that out. It's really an interesting question. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Louisiana Is certainly not the place if you're purely optimizing for health. Yeah, yeah, that's very true. So, like, it has been top of mind for us and we are trying to figure out if we did something next level, where would we go and how we do it. I wouldn't have an answer yet. Yeah, yeah. I think it's an important question. There's data on golf courses. I don't know if you've seen this. I have. If you live near a golf course, like, reduces your life expectancy because they use such heavy pesticides. On the golf course. Because how close to the golf course? There's one in my town that's probably not great. These studies were done on, like, people that live in, like a golf. Oh, like, right. So like, you're living on the golf course. Course. And they're. They're basically, you know, golfers just want it to look pretty. They're not asking, like, hey, what did you do to make it look so pretty? How are you? What are your long term kind of concerns around the health of us being in this studio? Rubber smell. Yeah. You smell it? Yes. So that is. I think it's these things. Honestly, I love that question so much. I would love. And I've. And I've thought about it a lot and I would love to work on this because, like, we have an LED light right here. I don't know about these lights. Maybe you can consult on our next. On our next. Honestly, we're moving soon, so I would. Love to come in here and do a comprehensive analysis. Oh, my God. No. The air. The air quality. I mean, we spend a lot of time here. Yeah. And we plan to spend. Brian's gonna Come back and say you guys have 10. We're like 10 years. Make nine, eight, seven. I mean first of all your CO2 levels for sure are too high. Sure. I can feel the CO2, right. Kate, do you feel the CO2? Yeah. You need a CO2 meter for sure. Yeah. So the space is too small. Yeah, I have the meter in my house. I'll move around to the different rooms to kind of track it and I've got a whole like I've done a bunch of work to the H vac. System and see over a thousand is going to impair your thinking. Totally. Yeah. So by the way that's obvious from the stream. You watch it like you're like these guys takes. I like sunglasses right now. What do you think? How are you thinking about parasites? There's tons of health influencers that will make parasites their whole thing and that like every, the solution to every problem is like got to fix the parasites. Yeah. How. How are you thinking about them? We. I've not done a deep dive into that. I don't know. So these are people who have parasites and they're trying to get rid of them. The argument is everyone has them. Yeah. Some amount are probably helpful because they'll like eat heavy metals and then you'll eventually kind of. Yeah. Release them. Things like that. But you should do a deep dive on that. Yep. Do you think how do you cycle supplements? Right now I'm taking L, theanine, glycine and a number of other things before bed. It's been super effective at getting REM and deep sleep up for me. But I'm curious when you find a supplement that is working and it's like measured in my case, how should you cycle it? How do you think about cycling it to make sure that you continue to get the benefit? Yeah. This is one of the questions we're asking the inference engine is because we've done a whole bunch of these different cycles and it's difficult because it's never truly a non confounded experiment. Right. There's always some confound and so when you're trying to tease out little tiny signal you do need to be robust about the analysis. So we don't know. We have some short term data on that but not strong enough that I think I'd express an opinion. So we're hopeful that the bigger data sets will give us insight. Same kind of question on fasting I've started. I inverted the fasting schedule because we do the show. We'll have like a big breakfast at 8am I'll have a second meal at around 2:30 and then I won't eat until the next day at 8am so typically somebody might start eating at 12, have another meal around dinner and then wait until the next day. So I flipped it. Any, any learnings from that? Personally the, the marker I would look for that probably. And to be clear, part, part of the reason is I actually, and there's a functional reason which is that the way that we do the show, I need to be like powered up, fueled up to then podcast for three hours. Yeah. But then I also don't like being having a big dinner and going to bed. Yeah, yeah. You guys work out in the morning together, is that right? Yeah. 6:30? Yeah, 6:30. Huge meal, huge meal at 8, 8. Yeah, 8 to 9. Yeah. Anyway, thank you.
Trust ourselves, just trust the data, do our protocol, see what it produces. But I, when I go in the world I'm just like, this is scary. Where, where do you get things like produce things that aren't ne. You know you're not going to add apples to the blueprint website, right? If you want to eat an apple, what do you do. It? So there's no safe place sadly like Brian Johnson yeah, we no. Safe place. To eat an. Apple. No apple is. Safe. Like we, you know people identify like plant based proteins have high toxins because they isolate that because you can test it. But if you eat a carrot it can have the same if not more toxins. And so it's just that this fresh produce is not measured. So people freak out what they can measure. But we've been testing fresh foods and packaged foods and toxins are throughout. And so it's just a very skewed perception on where toxins are at. But I typically buy, we do farmer's market, we'll do erewhon do whole foods when we test these fresh foods. So we do want to start growing our own. But even then it's hard because you're in the system in la it's a little rough. And even those systems themselves, like someone will try to get an escape route and say like well I've got, you know, I have a cow and a pasture fed, irrigated, whatever, like they can escape the toxins within the environment. So. It'S just. Very, very hard to create an isolated non toxic. So there's lots of, lots of toxins at risk.
Health wearables is. Yeah, so that's exactly again what we're building with this first three people and immortals. Like, if you say so. My life over the past five years has generated a few billion data points. Few hundred million are useful. That has created a dimensional representation of a human that is higher fidelity than anything ever produced in history. And so we've taken that model, we're going to replicate it with others. And so we're going to try to basically cast this gigantic net of data capture. We'll bring it all in and say, where's the highest signal inputs? And then we'll scale those things. And so, like, you're saying, like, we may find that lighting at bedtime is an incredibly important factor. And like, you know, right now people don't really think about that or the lighting environment in the room. And you can't do, like, specific photon counts. And so we're going to try to tease out, like, where are the little teeny tiny things that have this gigantic yield? But it's all about data collection. It's about the inference engine, and it's about people who are willing to say, you, yes, I'll follow the protocol because it's inherently better than what I would do myself. Or they're just guessing and then we'll have everything. Did you ever. Think about a program where an actual live human just follows around the person in the program and is effectively there 24 7, kind of like effectively a name.
And so like there's self driving cars, there's self writing software, this is autonomous health. So we're building AI that just says do this. And so do you remember early on when Facebook did that study where they said 300 likes on the platform and they could predict you better than your partner could? This was like the first time social media showed the power of prediction. And so there's an equivalent question for us is how much data do we need on your body, like of blood, of wearables, of whatever to predict you better than you can? And how. Do we stitch this together? So I think the free version is like some minimal viable amount of data that goes into our AI inference machine. And we then say do this and we can get higher yield than anything they could ever do themselves. And once that happens, once you take Awaymo, you're like, I'm never getting in with a human driver ever again. Right. It's a very clear. So this will be the same thing where once you, once you deal with the immortals of the product, you'd be like, I'm in. Definitely. This is a better control system than anything I could. Produce. How are you thinking about wearables? Most of the people that come on the show will be rocking an Apple watch, maybe a woo.
Was add like an extra avocado a day. That was the only thing he changed. And his tests like went up by a pretty meaningful multiple. So walk me through, you know, average American might spend, I don't know, $10,000 a year on food. What does it look like to get into the blueprint ecosystem at that order of magnitude? Then what can people do at $100,000 a year? And then I want to hear about the million dollar a year, all in plan. Well, we announced that today. Okay. So it's called Immortals. Immortals. A million dollars a year. And it's my exact protocol. It's your exact. My doctors, my concierge team, all the testing infrastructure, blood work too. Everything. Every test, every therapy. And so it's. I mean this has been really hard to build because it hasn't existed. So we just had to scour the evidence, build out the infrastructure globally. And this is basically when someone says, getting enough feedback. Let's turn that speaker off. Sorry. We're working on bringing the soundboard to life in the TVP and ultradump. Sorry, continue. Yeah, so I guess if you look at it three different frames, one is we measure probably around two hundred and 50 to 300 things that kill me. That will kill you. Actively kill you. Everything in the gas station? Yes, basically, I mean everything in the modern world. And so if you look at it from like, don't die. So what things actually cause you to die? And then if you look at it from the positive things of what makes you live, that list is probably like 250 things that kill you and 250 things that make you live well. And if you take on that burden as an individual to say, I want to do all of these things that make me avoid the things that make me die and do the things that do make me live well, that's a herculean task. So this program basically takes all of those things, makes it easy. So you just show up. It's like, what do I do? And the system tells you what to do. Yeah. What does the program look like more specifically? Like how is start? So you're doing three people, right? Yeah. Three thoughts, three to start. What do their weeks, months, year look like? So we'll do first? It depends on who the person is. So we have an interview process because the person needs to be willing to work. You can't just like show up and like give me a pill. You have to put in probably around. Like, I was promised immortality with a single shot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you tell me that's why it's called snake oil. Yeah, I got the best. So we have an interview process. We'll make sure the person's willing to put in the work, that they've got a pain tolerance. They can like, you know, like they have to be willing to do stuff. You know, sometimes therapies hurt, sometimes it hurts to be hungry. Sometimes like, so there's some discomfort. And then they will choose the three people and then we'll do a comprehensive baseline. So for me, over the past five years, we are counting yesterday, we have a few billion data points on me over the past five years. And so then if you say what of those few billion data points are usable? Probably a few hundred million, but still we have a few hundred million data points. And so what we've done is to date, I guess like years ago, that existed in spreadsheets and files. We've now set up an AI system where we take all the context. And now we have this inference engine to say like, what relationships can you find in all this data? And so what we're building is an AI, a Brian AI that basically watches after you 24 7. So you start, you do a whole bunch of comprehensive baselines where you at in the world? And then we start doing targeted protocols like how do you isolate cardiovascular health and how do you look at so on and so forth. And you're gonna find issues as well where the person may have a surprise finding. How do you address that? They'll have some anomaly. So then we just get after it and we just say like, how do you basically take the baseline measurements and make all of them better? Yeah. Do you want these people to be local? Can they be anywhere? Anywhere? Are they all over the world or US based? Is there advance.
Bedtime. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I can't sleep. Like, what do you do. Before bed? I'm in my bed. Like, you know. Scrolling TikTok and okay, well that, that could be the source. What's the current thinking on peptides? There's a variety of them. Semaglutide all the way down to reta. What's the most up to date, like evidence or benefits cost that you've seen? I mean, generally, peptides are fantastic. They are drugs, drug equivalents, drug like effect sizes. And some peptides have done the clinical work, like tirzepatide, but then there's a whole bunch of other class of peptides that we have no human data on. Really? Yes. So they. The things that people are taking a lot of. Right? A lot of. Yeah. So we're gonna get some human data. Is that currently retta. Is that the one that's like, not. I don't know about. I. Don'T know about retta, but. Or there's like even different ones. Like that I'm not even thinking of. There's a lot. Yeah, okay. There's a lot. There's like a long tail of all sorts of slightly different, slight one molecule change or something. And it's currently. I mean, it's all the rage. The Chinese peptide thing is a whole meme. In. San. Francisco. It's. A whole thing. Yeah. And so my take on this is if you do it, be cautious because we do not have them characterized. When you hear about a drug that does blood pressure control. You. Hear all the benefits. And then you hear like in the commercial you hear like, this may cause statins, this may cause death or kidney damage. Or you hear all the side effects. Because it's been well characterized. So it's gone through clinical trials, you understand the pros and the cons, and you make that trade off with peptides. You don't know. It's like your bro buddy's like, it does this amazing thing and it fits the whole. Yeah, but you're not getting statement after the. Fact of like, hey, by the way, this could do this terrible thing. Yeah. So if you're. Doing it, proceed with caution because they're not characterized. We don't know. It's not to say they couldn't have benefits. It's that you don't know. And that's the worst thing in health is the blind spots. People want to chase the positives but rarely adhere to. There could be some downsides. So keep costly. Wasn't that the name of Marty Mochrie's book Blind spots.
Wait for results and then feed that back in. 100% makes sense. You talked about testing, what are you finding in organic products? If something's organic, do you just automatically assume that it's not going to kill you? I assume. It'S. Worse than not organic. No, I'm serious. Junkyard dog theory. I'm vindicated. It's true. Honestly. Organic only looks at a certain subset of toxins. Sure. It's not all toxins. And then it's a very limited screening protocol. So it's really a marketing tactic. When we test organic, it typically performs worse than non organic on many, many variables. So, no, I think it's worthless, really, as a marketing protocol. And I would say more broadly, I don't trust anyone, literally. I don't trust marketing. I don't trust brands, trust no one. I don't trust technicians, I don't trust practitioners. Like, when we go out there, honestly, it just. That's why this protocol is. We've built it in such a meticulous fashion. We don't trust ourselves. Just trust the data, do our protocol, see what it produces. But when I go out in the world, I'm just like, this is scary. Where do you get things like produce things that aren't necessarily. You're not going to add. Apples to the blueprint website, Right? If you want to eat.
Before we bring in our first guest, we can pull this up. People are reacting to the men's luge doubles. They're saying it's one of the most baffling things I've ever watched. And national champion speaker says, how do you find out you're good at this? What's the conversation look like? I really want to know. I didn't know this. Doubles is funny. I guess I may have seen this before. I remember as a kid watching singles. But this is baffling. There's also something called scout. Like, what are you. What do you. I think it's an evolution. I think it starts with like a toboggan and you have like a bunch of people essentially in like a rowboat, you know, in like a long. Like if you're doing crew, you have like four or five people and then you're just like, let's do one less, let's do one less. Let's optimize and reduce weight. And then they're finally down to just two people and they're basically just on this, like sled together. And yeah, I guess you get here. But very, very funny. What else is going on in the Olympics? Personal injury attorney in his 50s is on the cusp of becoming the oldest American Winter Olympian in history. All he needs is for one of his teammates to slip and fall. This guy is elite. Remember the last Olympics where there was that great meme that came out where it was like the one person with all the gear and all this other stuff and then the random guy, I think, from Turkey who just showed up and was just like. And just like was. I think he won the gold or something. I don't know. That might have been too poetic. But Modest Proposal says it's an incredible. I feel like being a personal injury attorney is probably a great gig if you're in one of these kind of fringe Olympic sports. You know, you want to have some flexibility in your schedule. You want to be able to make enough to reinvest into the sport. This guy's clearly locked in. This guy is amazing. Okay, so Rich ruhonen is a 54 year old personal injury attorney who plays an indispensable role for the US Curling team. He cooks the players omelets before important matches. He grills steaks after huge wins. He handles the early morning grocery shopping so they can sleep in. What a team player. He chauffeurs them around in a rental minivan. He even pays for some of their flights and hotel rooms. But those aren't his only jobs. He is also the most unlikely curler at the Milan Cortina Games, where he could become the oldest American athlete in Winter Olympics history. And just in case people don't believe that someone nearing retirement age could possibly be an Olympic athlete, Rohonen answers the question on a homemade T shirt. Not the dad, and I'm not the coach, he says. But he is an American curling legend. Ruhonen first appeared in the national champion tournament in 1998. He's been doing it for overnight, 20 years, maybe won it a decade later, and has been a fixture in the sport since long before any of his teammates were born. What he had never done was curl under the sport's brightest lights. Rohonen just missed qualifying for the Olympics several times. His most recent heartbreak came before the 2020 Olymp Games, when the US trials mixed in doubles. 2022. 2022, sorry. When the US trials mixed in mixed doubles came down to the last shot, Rohonen decided to focus on his law practice and the senior circuit. At 50, he finally gave up on his Olympic aspirations. I honestly thought it was over four years ago, he said. Well, I probably thought it was over eight years before that. Then he got an unexpected call. He's back. The captain for one of the nation's up and coming teams was battling a rare autoimmune disease and needed a substitute. On paper, the Gen Xer wasn't the most natural fit. The other curlers were all in their mid-20s, roughly the same age as Ronan's children. He even has a few decades on Team USA's coach. Few decades, but on ice, he blended right in. So when skip Danny Casper recovered from his illness, in return, Rohonen stuck around as the alternate team. Casper then qualified for the Olympics and became Team usa. Ronan says throwing the rock at the Olympics would be the single greatest moment of his entire life. Rock. My kids know it and my wife knows it. I'm going to start using. I'm going to put on curling at home and just start using some of the hardcore terminology. Just be like, ah, I can't, I can't. You know, that happened a couple decades ago because on cnbc, which all the hedge funds watch, after the market closed, they would just roll over to NBC coverage when the two companies were together and they would show curling just because of the time change. That's what was on. And so all these Wall street guys became obsessed with curling, got really into it, started placing bets and stuff. It's a fun story. Yeah. I wonder how big is the gambling and sports betting around the Olympics. I don't know. I saw some numbers for the Super Bowl. It was really, really big. But you have to imagine that the Olympics is also huge. While you look that up, let me tell you about TurboPuffer. Serverless vector in full text search built from first principles and OB fast 10x cheaper and extremely scalable. And our next guest is here so we can come back to Olympics coverage after. But let's bring in Brian Johnson to the TVPN ultradome. I will tell you about Vibe co while he walks in. We're DTC companies, B2B startups and AI companies. Advertise on streaming TV, pick channels, target audiences and measure sales just like on Meta. And you might be doing some advertising soon because there's a huge launch. How are you doing? Hey. I brought you guys a gift. Thank you. What'd you bring? Are we doing shots? We're doing shots. Amazing. Here we go. Amazing. Yeah. Have you done a shot of olive oil? I haven't done. I've never done a shot of olive oil. What are the benefits? Break it down. Why would I do this? I like olive oil on a steak. Yeah, I mean, have you. Is olive oil a part of your life? Only in the cooking context. Yeah, but I should just be drinking it. I've done three shots yet. No. Yeah. What are the benefits? And what is this? Did you grow the olives? Is it cold pressed? Just this much. Should we not do a little bit more? No, no, no, no, no. This is live TV. 15 milliliters. This is live TV. Yeah. This is the precise dose. 15 milliliters. 15 milliliters. One tablespoon. Okay, what's this gonna do for. It's the. I think it's the superfood of superfoods. Okay, it does. I mean, just like you look down the list of things. It does. It's just good for almost everything. Okay, so is it high calorie? How many calories? 130 calories in this. Okay. Calories don't scare you though? No, I mean, it's 15% of my daily caloric intake. I consume more olive oil than any food. Y Like shots is that roughly so 45. So three tablespoons a day. 45 milliliters. Three shots a day. Okay, so one with every meal? One with every meal. Okay. Well, cheers. Cheers to Brian Johnson. Blueprint. Cheers. Down the hatch. Delicious. That is good. Smooth. Very smooth. No problem. I could do that. No bite. And so. And so I just drank 15 milliliters of olive oil and I'm going to live Forever now, right? Basically. So now I can go back to diet. One shot it and nicotine. One shot of steaks, right? Yeah. Do you feel the sting now? A little bit. I do, I do. Like a little cough bubbling up. Yeah, yeah. Perfect for broadcasting. Yeah, yeah, that's. It's a good sign of a good olive oil. So we source this in both hemispheres so it's always fresh. Okay. So it comes off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're more specific. Specifically, this one's from Chili. Chili. And the brand is called snake oil. That's right. Very funny. How does this fit into the overall blueprint? What do you call Empire at this point? I mean, the whole thing on blueprint is we are trying to basically say what does the evidence say for what you can do to be healthy? And we just went after the best foods, the best therapies. And what I found is basically most things don't work. Most things are bullshit. And so we've tried to narrow in, to focus on the most narrow number of set of things to do. And olive oil just stacks. It's like one of the very best things you can do in life is. Part of why this isn't pushed more aggressively by the sort of health industry is that it's just kind of hard to deliver. A lot of people don't want to just be consuming oil. And that's kind of like the bit is that some people are selling. Pushing snake oil. Yeah, that too. I mean, yes. I mean, people, I think, have a natural aversion to fat still. There was that. There was a long period of time where fat was bad. And you saw marketing. 30% less fat, 40% less fat. So people think olive oil fat, therefore bad. So there's like hangover. Yeah. I had a buddy that had internalized that so much that he was on a almost entirely fat free diet. He got his labs done. He had like low. His test was in the low hundreds. All he did was add like an extra avocado a day. That was the only thing he changed. His tests like, went up, like by a pretty meaningful multiple. So walk me through. Average American might spend, I don't know, $10,000 a year on food. What does it look like to get in the blueprint ecosystem at that order of magnitude? Then what can people do at $100,000 a year? And then I want to hear about the million dollar a year, all in plan. Well, we announced that today, so it's called Immortals. Immortals. A million dollars a year. And it's my exact protocol. It's your Exact protocol, my doctors, my concierge team, all the testing infrastructure work, too. Everything. Every test, every therapy. And so it's. I mean, this has been really hard to build because it hasn't existed. So you just had to scour the evidence, build out the infrastructure globally. And this is basically when someone says, getting a feedback. Let's turn that speaker off. Sorry. We're working on bringing the soundboard to life in the TVP and ultradome. Sorry, continue. Yeah, so the. I guess, like, if you look at it three different frames, like, one is, we measure probably around 250 to 300 things that kill me. That will kill you. Actively kill you. Everything in the gas station. Yes, basically. I mean, everything in the modern world. And so if you look at it from, like, don't die. Okay, so what things actually cause you to die? And then if you look at it from the positive things of what makes you live, that list is probably like 250 things that kill you and 250 things that make you live well. And if you take on that burden as an individual, to say, I want to do all of these things that make me avoid the things that make me die and do the things that do make me live, well, that's a herculean task. So this program basically takes all of those things, makes it easy. So you just show up. It's like, what do I do? And the system tells you what to do. Okay. Yeah. What does the program look like more specifically? Like, how is it start with. It's very. So you're doing three people, right? Yeah. Three thoughts, three to start. What do their weeks, months, year look like? So we'll do first? It depends on who the person is. We have an interview process because the person needs to be willing to work. You can't just show up and give me a pill. You have to put in probably around. Like, I was promised immortality with a single shot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's why it's called snake oil. Yeah, you got the best. So we have an interview process. We'll make sure the person's willing to put in the work, that they've got a pain tolerance, you know, they can, like, you know, like, they have to be willing to do stuff. You know, sometimes therapies hurt. Sometimes it hurts to be hungry. Sometimes, like, so there's some discomfort. And then they will choose the three people, and then we'll do a comprehensive baseline. So for me, over the past five years, we are counting yesterday. We have a few billion data points on me over the past five years. And so if you say what of those few billion data points are usable? Probably a few hundred million, but still we have a few hundred million data points. And so what we've done is to date, I guess like years ago that existed in spreadsheets and files. We've now set up an AI system where we take this, we take all the context and now we have this inference engine to say what relationships can you find in all this data? And so what we're building is an AI, a Brian AI that basically watches after you 24 7. So you start, you do a whole bunch of comprehensive baselines where you're at in the world. And then we start doing targeted protocols like how do you isolate cardiovascular health and how do you look at so on and so forth. Then you're going to find issues as well where the person may have a surprise finding. How do you address that? They'll have some anomaly. So then we just get after it and we just say like how do you basically take the baseline measurements and make all of them better? Yeah. Do you want these people to be local? Can they be anywhere? Anywhere? Are they all over the world or US based? Is there advances? We're open, open to everything. Okay, interesting. How are you thinking about AI? When I think about product like snake oil, I think not a lot of AI disruption risk should not be sold off in this SaaS apocalypse. You're not going to vibe code an olive tree. The land exists, the tree exists. You have to select it, press it. There's probably a lot of people involved that there might be some automated ERP system at some point. But how are you thinking about the impacts of AI on your business, your life? I know that that's a big piece of the don't die philosophy is that we are going to go through a change. But how are you processing the most up to date advances in AI? Yeah, you're exactly right. Is like this olive oil we source from farmers all around the world that go through extensive screening. We test every single, every single molecule that we manufacture. We third party test. So they're all very manual processes. And then on the other side we have AI where you take all the data, you do the inference engine, you try to find new insights that's never been found before. But we're this really weird mixture of leading edge AI and like duct taped together of all the manual things like we'll go into someone's house, you measure for mold and toxins and water toxins and air toxins and you look at materials in the house. So it's still very manual and automated. So it's kind of a cool world where we're insulated to some extent. In terms of software, you just stand it up. You're very vulnerable to speed where this one, you're dealing the physical world constraints, you have to bring together all these different disciplines. Yeah. And there's also this interesting break in that if you want to measure the change in someone over a year and you want to do a year long study, even if you have a million Einsteins in a data center, you have to wait a year to get those results. I'm sure there's more things that you can do digging up historical data, all the data that you have, but there is just this natural break on progress when you have to wait for results and then feed that back in 100%. Makes sense. You talked about testing, what are you finding in organic products? If something's organic, do you just automatically assume that it's not going to kill you? I assume it's worse than not. Oh yeah. No, I'm serious. It's junkyard dog theory. I'm vindicated. It's true. Honestly, organic only looks at a certain subset of toxins. It's not all toxins. And then it's a very limited screening protocol. So it's really a marketing tactic. When we test organic, it typically performs worse than non organic on many, many variables. So no, I think it's worthless really as a marketing protocol. And I would say more broadly, I don't trust anyone. Like literally, I don't trust marketing, I. Don'T trust brands, trust no one. I don't trust technicians, I don't trust practitioners. Like when we go out there, honestly, it just, that's why this protocol is, we've built it in such a meticulous fashion. We don't trust any, we don't trust ourselves, just trust the data, do our protocol, see what it produces. But when I got in the world I'm just like, this is scary. Where do you get things like produce things that aren't, you know you're not gonna add apples to the blueprint website, right? If you want to eat an apple, what do you do? So there's no safe place, sadly. Brian Johnson. No safe place to eat an apple? No apple is safe. People identify, like plant based proteins have high toxins because they isolate that, because you can test it. But if you eat a carrot, it can have the same, if not more toxins. And so it's just that this fresh produce is not measured. So people freak out about what they can measure. But we've been testing fresh foods and packaged foods and toxins are throughout. And so it's just a very skewed perception on where toxins are at. But I typically buy with a farmer's market. We'll do Erewholm, do whole foods when we test these fresh foods. So we do want to start growing our own. But even then it's hard because you're. In the system in la, it's a little rough. And even those systems themselves, like someone will try to get an escape route and say like, well, I've got, you know, I have a cow and a pasture fed, irrigated, whatever. Like they can escape the toxins within the environment. So it's just very, very hard to create an isolated non toxic. So there's lots of, lots of toxins at risk out in the real world. Talk about other risks in the real world. Have you ever been frame mogged? Sure. People have tried. You know what? That is so good. We should put that on the list. That escaped our. For a million bucks, you gotta protect. Me from frame logging. That's like the first thing that I. Want from a protocol, honestly. Yeah. What a blind spot we had. We should have picked that one up. Yes. How are you processing the looksmaxing virality that's going on? It feels like very tangential. In some ways there's some overlap. I've seen, you know, the looks maxers say don't worry about the macros or the micronutrients or the toxins at all. All that matters is how much protein you're getting because they have a very live fast, die young. But there's still some overlap in that they're trying to look good. We've talked about this before. Well, yeah, in many ways I feel like you've been looks maxing. You wouldn't necessarily call it that. But you can just see every now and then a photo will go viral where it's like you every six months. And people are like, wait, it's working. So in some ways it's kind of marketing. There's a lot of work kind of under the surface that's contributing to that. But at the same time it's very clear, like people want you to look better every month or they're gonna say like, hey, can I really trust this guy? Yeah. I mean there's two things. One is like you guys, you're just positioned towards advertising, you know, it's like, yes and yeah, like if someone's out there doing their thing, you know, like more Power to them. And like whatever their jam is, if they're doing look smacking like, you know, do your art and be beautiful, that's great. And so yeah, I'm very much a proponent of let humans be beautiful in their manifestation. Sure. We're basically, we're saying that as we all realize something's happening in the world right now, it's big with AI in some form or fashion, it's evolving the world. And our primary hypothesis is as this evolves, the major shift is humans are going to want life. If AI takes our jobs or they take what we do and we want to find new identity, there's gonna be a major shift towards don't die. And it's gonna become probably the most dominant ideology in the world very quickly because we're gonna be pointing ourselves towards vibrancy. That is an interesting encapsulation because it does feel a little bit like the two paths meme with the dark castle and the bright palace in the sense that a lot of the looks maxers are saying they're black pilled. They don't believe that there will be a future. So health actually takes a backseat to looks because that's what helps you get ahead this year, this month. And it's very short termism, very short term thinking. You've always framed it from day one around very long term thinking. So even though I think people might say, oh well, like he's trying to look good, that guy's trying to look good, they're similar, there's actually a huge divergence in the philosophy. At least it feels like that. I don't know. Jordy, what do you think? I had another question. Please take it. So you have this. You're starting with the ultra premium product, the million dollars a year. And I can see all the justification for that. I imagine you want to go more and more kind of like down market over time so that somebody, if they have a million dollars or $100,000 or $10,000 or 1,000 or 100 can, can kind of benefit with the program. It feels like there would be an insane amount of demand for something like right today, $1,000 program, something that's effectively a PDF that somebody could pay for download and because they paid for it. We talked about this yesterday because Tai Lopez was in the news because of his whole Radio Shack debacle. And I was saying when I was probably 18 or 19, I paid for a PDF of a workout plan. And because I paid for it, I followed it really closely and I got a lot more value for my money. Whereas I feel like for you, the second that you launch a traditional info product, you will be attacked. Even though I think that at $1,000 you could put something together that would provide somebody, potentially tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands. Right. Just because in the health game, if you just buy a PDF and then that gets you to sleep an extra hour a night for the rest of your life, like the, the economic value creation or the money that you're not spending on hospital bills or things like that would be tremendous. How are you thinking about that? Because again, I think that there would be value there for me paying again for that thousand dollar product that I could just kind of follow and learn something from. The value would be there. But how are you thinking about it? Yeah, that's exactly what we're doing. And so the target audience we're after is those who want to say yes to health. And we say do this. So we're not. If you want to go out and find your source, your own peptides, inject yourself and do your own protocol, do that. We are going to deliver autonomous health. And so like there's self driving cars, there's self writing software, this is autonomous health. So we're building AI that just says do this. And so do you remember early on when Facebook did that study where they said 300 likes on the platform and they could predict you better than your partner could? This was like the first time social media showed the power of prediction. And so there's an equivalent question for us is how much data do we need on your body, like of blood, of wearables, of whatever to predict you better than you can? And how do we stitch this together? So I think the free version is like some minimal viable amount of data that goes into our AI inference machine. And we then say do this and we can get higher yield than anything they could ever do themselves. And once that happens, once you take away more, you're like, I'm never getting into with a human driver ever again. It's a very clear. So this will be the same thing where once you deal, once you deal with the immortals as a product, you'd be like, I mean definitely this is a better control system than anything I could produce. How are you thinking about wearables? Most of the people that come on the show will be rocking an apple watch, maybe a whoop or an aura. It's very, very common. At the same time, it's missing visual, it's not like pulling in, it's not like the health decisions that somebody makes Every day can't always be picked up here. It'd be great to have be like, okay, what did this person eat? What time did they actually go to bed? All these different things. What do you think the future of health wearables is? Yeah, so that's exactly again what we're building with this first three people and more immortals. Like, if you say so. My life over the past five years has generated a few billion data points. A few hundred million are useful. That has created a dimensional representation of a human that is higher fidelity than anything ever produced in history. And so we've taken that model and replicated with others. And so we're going to try to basically cast this gigantic net of data capture. We'll bring it all in and say, where's the highest signal inputs? And then we'll scale those things. And so like you're saying, we may find that lighting at bedtime is an incredibly important factor. And right now people don't really think about that or the lighting environment in the room. And you can't do specific photon counts. And so we're going to try to tease out where are the little teeny tiny things that have this gigantic yield. But it's all about data collection. It's about the inference engine and it's about people who are willing to say, yes, I'll follow the protocol because it's inherently better than what I would do myself, whether it's guessing and then we'll have everything. Did you ever think about a program where an actual live human just follows around the person in the program and is effectively there 24 7, kind of like effectively a nanny for the human? Because it's like, hey, like you say you're doing everything right, but like right before bed you had a phone just blasting light in your face. It feels like that's kind of what you can get to with wearables over time and you can probably get there today. But I think a lot of people, even if they do a program, will still be kind of sneaking little things in throughout the day that are working against them. And they even forget, you know, they're like, I do everything you say. Like, I, you know, I finished my final meal today four hours before bed and blah, blah. You are hiding bright lights before bedtime. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I can't sleep. Like, what do you do before bed? I'm in my bed, like, you know, scrolling TikTok and okay, well that could be the source. What's the current thinking on peptides? There's a variety of them. Semaglutide all the way down to reta. What's the most up to date evidence or benefits cost that you've seen? I mean, generally peptides are fantastic. They are drugs, drug equivalents. They have drug like effect sizes and some peptides have done the clinical work like tirzepatide and. But then there's a whole bunch of other class of peptides that we have no human data on. Really? Yes. So the thing that people are taking a lot of. A lot of. Yeah. So we're gonna get some human data. Is that currently Retta. Is that the one that's like not improved? I don't know about retta, but. Or there's like even different ones like that I'm not even thinking of. There's a lot of. Yeah, okay. There's a lot, there's like a long tail of like all sorts of slightly different slight 1 molecule chains or something. And it's currently. I mean, it's all the rage. Yeah, the, the Chinese peptide thing is a whole meme in San Francisco. It's a whole thing. And so my take on this is if you do it, be cautious because we do not have them characterized. When you hear about a drug that does blood pressure control, you hear all the benefits. And then you hear in the commercial you hear statins, this may cause death or kidney damage. You hear all the side effects because it's been well characterized. So it's gone through clinical trials. You understand the pros and the cons and you make that trade off with peptides. You don't know. Yeah, it's like your, your bro buddy's like, it does this amazing thing and it fits. Yeah. But you're not getting incentivized, you're not. Getting statement after the fact of like, hey, by the way, this could do this terrible thing. Yeah. So if you're doing it, proceed with caution because they're not characterized. We don't know. It's not to say they couldn't have benefits. It's that you don't know. And that's the, the worst thing in health is the blind spots. You know, people want to chase the positives but rarely adhere to like, you know, there could be some downside. So keep costly. Yeah. Wasn't that the name of Marty Mochrie's book, Blind Spots, the new FDA commissioner? I'm pretty sure that's what he called it. Do you have confidence in the FDA right now? Do you have confidence in the FDA's ability to actually collect all the data and make good recommendations? Because there's some things where I totally agree with you. I'd much rather take the one that's gone through FDA trials then approved. It tells me the downsides, but at the same time people are like, but I also got all this sugar in my cereal for years. Like, what, were they asleep at the wheel back then? Like, what's going on? Yeah, I'm, I'm guessing that we, like the FDA has a very valuable purpose in society. They do. Of course they do good work. Yeah. I'm guessing they stopped the literal snake oil famous. Exactly. Yes, they did. Yeah. Like they've had, they've had a positive role. I think that we will exceed them in value in many core areas. Okay. Because they can take well structured, well funded clinical trials. But then other things like peptides that are very promising, they're not going to have the clinical work. So what do you do? So if we could get a certain number of people on the platform who are doing peptides, great, and if they can start adding dimensionality to their bio collection, we could have the most valuable data set. So it's Immortals is the product that's the high end right now, but then also the free version we're building. And our goal is to create the world's largest data set across all these actors. And then you basically can create an ecosystem where the person could be paid for their data. So they collect the data, they're starting to the experimentation. Companies come in and buy the data or they give out. So we're trying to create this financially incentivized ecosystem where in the world right now you can't go anywhere without somebody or something trying to take advantage of you. It's just everywhere. Try to think of a company that genuinely acts in your best interest. Like unequivocally always shows up to act in your best interest. Diet Coke. Always there when John needs it. Except when the flight attendant says, how about Pepsi? Yeah, that's true. We're going to try to stand in that role where we're all so jaded because everyone's trying to take advantage of us. So we're going to try to stand in that role that you can unequivocally trust us. We will always act in your best interest. And if we do that, then I'm willing to share my data, I'm willing to engage in the platform and do the exploration. So. Hi, Bar, I want to run through kind of a lightning round of questions. What have you learned from Ray Pete? That there's a lot of Ray Peters on X yeah. And they really want you to follow their. Yeah, they do. They want you to Pete out. They do, yeah. So they're definitely evangelists. So Ray Pete has a lot of evangelists. Carrots. Underrated. Overrated. Yeah. Carrots are a great food. They're not benign. Like, no food is benign. It has pros and cons. What else? Journey. Where would you live if you weren't a public figure and you could just optimize for health? Yeah. You know, Kate's here. Hey, Kate. Hey, Kate. Yeah, we were just having this conversation. She's from Australia. We were just having this conversation, trying to figure that out. It's really an interesting question. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Louisiana Is certainly not the place if you're purely optimizing for health. Yeah, yeah, that's very true. So, like, it has been top of mind for us and we are trying to figure out if we did something next level, where would we go and how we do it. I wouldn't have an answer yet. Yeah, yeah. I think it's an important question. There's data on golf courses. I don't know if you've seen this. I have. If you live near a golf course, it like, reduces your life expectancy because they use such heavy pesticides. On the golf course. Because how close to the golf course? There's one in my town that's probably not great. These studies were done on like people that live in like a golf. Oh, like, right. So like you're living on the golf course and they're. They're basically, you know, golfers just want it to look pretty. They're not asking like, hey, what did you do to make it look so pretty realistic. How are you saying, what are your long term kind of concerns around the health of us being in this studio? Rubber smell. You smell it? Yes. So that is. I think it's these things. Honestly, I love that question so much. I would love. And I've thought about it a lot and I would love to work on this because I have an LED light right here. I don't know about these lights. Maybe you can consult on our next. On our next. Honestly, we're moving soon, so I would. Love to come in here and do a comprehensive analysis. Oh, my God. No. The air, the air quality. I mean, we spend a lot of time here. Yeah. And we plan to spend. Brian's going to come back and say, you guys have 10. We're going to make 10 years. You make nine, eight, seven. I mean, first of all, your CO2 levels for sure are too high. Sure. I can feel the CO2 right Kate, do you feel the CO2? Yeah, I need a CO2 meter for sure. Yeah. So the space is too small. Yeah, I have the meter in my house. I'll move around to the different rooms to kind of track it and I've got a whole like I've done a bunch of work to the H vac. System and see over a thousand is going to impair your thinking totally. Yeah. So by the way that's obvious from the stream. You watch it like you're like these. Guys takes I like sunglasses right now. What do you think? How are you thinking about parasites? There's tons of health influencers that will make parasites their whole thing and that like every. The solution to every problem is like got to fix the parasites. Yeah. How. How are you thinking about them? We. I've not done a deep dive into that. I don't know. These are people who have parasites and they're trying rid of them. The argument is everyone has them. Yeah. Some amount are probably helpful because they'll like eat heavy metals and then you'll eventually kind of. Yeah. Release them, things like that. But you should do a deep dive. Okay. Yep. No. Do you think. How do you cycle supplements? Right now I'm taking L theanine, glycine and a number of other things before bed. It's been super effective at getting REM and deep sleep up for me. But I'm curious when you find a supplement that is working and it's like measured in my case, how should you cycle it? How do you think about cycling it to make sure that you continue to get the benefit? Yeah. This is one of the questions we're asking the inference engine is because we've done a whole bunch of these different cycles and it's difficult because it's never truly a non confounded experiment. Right. There's always some confound and so when you're trying to tease out little tiny signal you do need to be robust about the analysis. So we don't know. We have some short term data on that but not strong enough that I think I'd express an opinion. So we're hopeful that the bigger data sets will give us insight. Same kind of question on fasting I've started. I inverted the fasting schedule because we do the show. We'll have like a big breakfast at 8am I'll have a second meal at around 2:30 and then I won't eat until the next day at 8am so typically somebody might start eating at 12, have another meal around dinner and then wait until the next day. So I flipped it. Any. Any learnings from that? Personally, the. The marker. I would look for that probably. And to be clear, part. Part of the reason is I actually. And there's a functional reason which is that the way that we do the show, I need to be like powered up, fueled up to then podcast for three hours. Yeah. But then I also don't like being. Having a big dinner and going to bed. Yeah. Yeah. You guys work out in the morning together, is that right? Yeah, yeah. 6:30. At 6:30, huge meal. Huge meal at 8, 8, 8 to 9. Yeah. Anyway, thank you so much for coming on the show. This is fantastic. Lots more to talk about. Yeah, we can go all day. Let me tell you about MongoDB. Choose a bit of the end of the week flexibility and scale with best in class embedding models and re rankers. MongoDB has what you need to build what's next. And without further ado, we have Matthew Zeitlin, the correspondent from heatmap News in the restream waiting room. Let's give it up for Corres. I'll tell you about Figma while we wait for him. Figma make isn't your average vibe coding tool. It lives in Figma so outputs look good, feel real and stay connected to how teams build, create code back prototypes. Apparently Tyler tested the CO2. We're at 790. We're at 810 right now. 810 and rising. He caught us on a loadout. It's going up. He said 1000. He said it was good. Under a thousand to see what it was at the end of the show. Okay. Okay. Because we will add more CO2 as the show goes on. Edge in the chat says Jordy has three days and one he's figured out how to manipulate time. You are manipulating time. Anyway, we have our next guest in the restream waiting room. Let's bring him into the TVPN ultradome. How are you doing? Sorry to keep you waiting. What's happening? I'm doing great, guys. Any opportunity to follow up. Brian Johnson is one I will take. It is a fun story. Yeah, he was your opener. I mean, you've clearly been doing a lot of looks maxing what's working for you. You know, I do have friends actually. John and I play a poker game with Ray Pete. I've been at least hearing about. I've been. I immediately resonated with the work of Ray Pete. Have followed a lot of it myself. I think it would Absolutely.