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Very cool. Tell us about what you're building. Tell us about Griffin. Yeah, I mean, so, I mean, Tavis, in a nutshell, we're a research lab focused on human computing, so we want to deliver a feature where using a machine will feel like talking to a friend or coworker. And today we released our biggest breakthrough model yet. It's called Griffin. It's a human interaction model, and it's the first model to pass a Turing Test. Did it actually pass? I'm looking at the data. 48% of testers, 26 out of 54 believed Griffin was a real person. That feels like you barely didn't pass. Well, to be clear, before, the next best model had less than a 2% pass rate. I'm not saying it's not amazing. I'm not saying it's not the best. I'm not saying it's not. So saying his job's not finished. I'm saying job's not finished. Oh, 100%. There's also, when you're getting asked, do you think this is an AI video? You're also, like, playing. It's playing rock, paper. Okay, this is a good point. You might want to do something. You might. You might. You might have an instinct to do something, but you know you're being tested. Yeah. So you're going to look for. Yeah. You're going to kind of cheat. You're, like, looking for the details in the background. Okay. We did. We did do, like, a human baseline as well. And so, like, we did that so that people who might have been like, oh, I'm being tricked. And like, you know, 15% of them thought that the real human was AI. And so we used all this in the study. And so this is like a. We have a lot of work to do. Which One is the A.I. here it is. The one who's talking. The ginger lady. You. You are AI right now. Oh, I'm also. Okay. Yeah. Because I was watching this and I thought the guy with the Rubik's Cube was AI. So you got. You fooled me. Yeah. You did it. All right, so how are you gonna make money? How are you making money on this? We're commercial. Guys, I can imagine so many things, but what's the beachhead market? Yeah, I mean, essentially, like, we use these models to power what we call, like, pals, right? Which is like AI employees, AI coworkers, AI companions. And so people are building ASCRN Salesforce website. They may ask, that's powered by Tavis, the Continuum Allocation. AI tutors, like AI Healthcare workers, like, all these things where, like, you would normally need a human, like, you need their eq, need their trust, you need to be able to see those are, like, not enough of them. And, like, that. Those are the markets that we're going after and that are already using our model. Okay, so is this. Is this a bet? Because there's been various attempts at making these kind of, like, live interactive video models that have, you know, frontier, near frontier intelligence. But oftentimes, like, if you're doing, you know, I've. I've seen people complaining or even film, like, there's viral Instagram videos where they're filming themselves doing, like a. Like a screening call for. For a company, and it's like, hello, how are you today? You know, and it's like, it's very. And so is the bet here that, like, once the models are just way better, there will be, like, exponentially more demand and consumers will stop being frustrated by them? Exactly that. Right. Like, the thing is that essentially, like, the closer that we get to passing the Turing Test, the more people, they. They know it's AI because it's disclosed, but they just don't care because it's like the most natural thing you could do is, like, instead of, like, trying to figure out what to prompt the machine or, like, what button to click, or, like, you're, like, waiting for it to respond. It just feels like. Just feels like you're talking to another human. So you don't even think about it. You know, it's AI. You don't even think about it at all. Walk me through how you're grappling with the various debates of how this technology gets rolled out, the potential downsides. I imagine you're not going open. Wait, but is there a process to onboard a customer so that, you know, it's not literally just a scammer who's trying to get grandma to send a gift card or something? Yeah. Yeah. So with Griffin, we're doing an early research preview, so we only releasing it to select testers. And it's exactly for that. Right. It is the first model and by far the largest sort of leap ahead, passing Turing tests. So we're like, we know we have to do more safety work, but we want to do, like, proper disclosure work, make sure the model always says that it's an AI and not a human. Yeah. And so we working through those safety or testing and do, like, safe releases. So we're probably going to be releasing it over the next couple months, and then on the actual, like, you know, Job's not finished. Like, where this goes, it feels like Turing test passed on. You know, basic zoom call. Where do you want, like, what capabilities do you want to unlock next? I can imagine. Like, it's nice to be able to talk to somebody and it looks like they're on a video, but occasionally you'll want that person to, like, stand up and go get an object and show it to you. And I don't know if the model can do that yet. And there's, like, other things that happen in the course of a zoom call. Where do you see this all going? Yeah, I mean, I think what's really special about this model is that it is actually capable doing a lot of these movements. Like, it won't get up and walk away just yet, though technically it's capable. But, like, it's a small things. Like, it should, like, shift around her chair. It can, like, it can do gestures. It can, like, touch its face because it feels nervous. Like, all these things that humans would naturally do, and it builds all this trust. But really what we're trying to go with this is, like, how do we make these more capable? Like, how do we make them more capable employees, more capable assistants, more capable sort of coworkers? And then how do we make it so that the interface sort of disappears? Like, you don't think about it, and you're just asking it to do its work, and it does. It just goes and does it. So that's like intelligence, and then there's like, the Turing Test. Naturalness. Yeah. Yeah. I can imagine virtual guitar tutor being a really hard benchmark, I think. I think that's really good. So one of my. That actually one of my sort of use cases that I want to unlock is like, teaching me piano. Because it can see. It can. Already has perception, so it can see. And people are already using it to do sorts of training. So you can hold things up. You can. People like our team and others, like, they'll play chess with it, and it's telling. It's like, play against them. So those are all things it can do. But like piano and guitar, definitely difficult because it can't tell a difference between, like, different. Like, it is. It doesn't know the difference between different keys and stuff yet, but it'll get there. Like, all these things will get there. And so being able to have, like, a personal tutor, personal trainer for every single person is like, that's the dream. Yeah. No, makes a ton of sense. How. How are you? Like, am I right to assume that when. If somebody's like talking to a pal, like a virtual coworker, and then that pal is going to go off and like, do work in the background. Let's say you have like, let's jump on a quick call, talk about the thing we want to do, and then the PAL decides to go do work. Will that workflow be model agnostic? Because there are a bunch of specialized models and frontier models that you can use to just run in the background. And you don't need to really focus there. You need to focus on, like the interaction. Collaboration. Exactly, exactly. So, like the way we like to talk about it is like the Oracle and the Envoy. Like, we're building the envoy model. Like its job is to just have really great conversation, understand and simulate human behavior. And then whenever it needs to do something that it can't do in conversation, it goes off to the big model in the sky and goes, hey, let's work together on this. Let's do this in the background. And so it can reach out to any tool, any model, and go do that work rather than this model doing everything. Absolutely. Yeah. Well, congratulations on the progress. Very impressive stuff. And I'm sure you'll be back on the show soon. Very cool. Have a great rest of the day. Great to meet you. Congrats on the progress. Do some donuts in the Corvette next time you join in the lobby. Yeah, there's like a fundraising milestone in the lobby would be great. Fantastic. Great to hang. Have a good one. Goodbye. Let me tell you about MongoDB. What's the only thing faster than the AI market your business on MongoDB? Don't just build AI, own the data platform that powers it.

Ways. Betty Talk. Have you been. Have you been surprised that the sort of tech industry saw that data centers were unpopular and decided to start calling them AI factories? Because I'm sure you work with, like, thousands of factories, actual factories globally that are actually producing, you know, wastewater. They might have a smokestack or something. They're not the most aesthetic things, I would think you want to not go towards that last thing you want to be. Yes. Thank you. Oh, my God. Yeah, well, I don't think it's the right thing. And it's going. Both sides are going so kind of against each other in crazy ways and thinking, well, if I spend more money so against you, I'm going to convince you that you're wrong and that you're going to say yes to my stuff. That's where we are right now. That's the exact wrong way. And we're talking with the hyperscalers, the colocators as well into say, calm down. Get closer to the folks in your communities, the schools, the churches, the NGOs, the communities. They're good people. They're like us. They Americans. They want to have a good life in front of them. Speak less loud. Try to listen. Come with Solutions. Technology is going to help all those things there. And for whatever reason, we spent two weeks in China a week ago. Well, 90% love it. Yeah, well, that's exactly what the Chinese want us to slow down. You say, well, are we doing the right thing here? Well, maybe not. No, I completely agree.

Maybe not. I completely agree. Tell me about some of the other product lines. And I don't know if you have a strong thesis on this, but I'm very interested in desalination. I remember, I remember Blake Masters during one of his campaign runs talking about the future of California should be nuclear powered desalination because that would allow the Colorado river to flow back to Nevada and Arizona and sort of create this lush inland area. And I was like, from a tech sounds great. From a technology perspective, it sounded doable on a long enough timeline. But I haven't. We talked to CEOs all the time. We haven't talked to that many people that are like, I'm going to be the one who's doing the mega project on desalination. We've talked to plenty of people that want to do that nuclear. What is your view on desalination? Well, it sounds great because obviously we're surrounded by water. Especially when you're in California, you don't have that problem. In Minnesota, where I'm living, it's kind of far away from, from the sea. But desalination is not the solution for the future. It requires a lot of power to get it done. It needs to be close to the sea, obviously. Otherwise you don't get much salt water. That creates job political issues as well. Look at what's happening with the big oil pipeline in Saudi that got destroyed by the Houthis as well. Well, that's creating a big issue in the country. If it's water, which is the case in Saudi, by the way, you have another problem because you can cut the water access as well. So to big cities there's a much simpler solution which is to do what nature has always done. The concept of wastewater is just a wrong concept. It's an engineering. For an engineer like me, I'm an aerospace engineer. This is just a flaw. Nature has never done it that way. It's always in a circular way. It's in a lake, it evaporates, it goes to the clouds, it goes down, it gets filtered, it gets used and all that, whether we like it or not. Well, the water that we're drinking today, well, has been through a human a few hundred prior. Don't overthink it, just keep it cycling. Yeah, it makes perfect sense. Keep recycling. You know, with the fabs. We have that discussion in, in Taiwan, in Korea. Here in the country we have this art of putting those fabs in places where there's absolutely no water. Well, you need ultra pure water for a fab. You're familiar with it. It's a million times more pure than the water you put in your own body in an injection. Well, that's hard to recycle. To make sure that you get to the highest standard, we've developed those technologies at a trip to water level. Well, guess what? You recycle the water, you get higher purity water, which means that you can get lower than the 2nm and you get a higher yield as well. So from 50, 60% to 80, 85%. This is billions. Why wouldn't we do that? You don't need a diesel plant to do that, okay?

With pigs, even though the pig likes it and you get muddy. Yeah. Okay, let's wrestle. Yeah. What are we wrestling about today? Yeah. So we kind of caught some of this live at the beginning of the show yesterday. But the posts kept flowing yesterday. What really got people up in arms was Vinod coming in and saying you are a struggling second tier competitor. That is more unethical and lying just because you have no decency or sense of proper behavior and shows your desperation straight out. Lying about if Chris being fired I thought would be below even you just like the most. The most Crashing out on Matan's personal crash out. Sure. So crash out on crash out. Violence. Sort of a three car pile. It only took about 20 seconds for people to put it together that Coastal Ventures is of course an investor in factory and cognition and like a pretty big one. Right. But is funny enough an example that like venture firms can have firewalls and individual people that have exposure to one company that might want to get involved with another company can still behave in a way that is ultimately like ethical. Yeah. Right. I'm not saying that the node, you know, attacking his portco is. But was Keith still at FF when cognition. When they did cognition. I think he might have already been at Khosla potentially then. And so I think Keith might be the factory board member or something. I don't know. I just saw Keith coming to Matan's defense. Right. Which is obviously the Coastal Adventures divide. But that's the nature of these partnerships. Sort of. He sort of clear that Vinod is not using AI for these posts. Totally total, all over the place, grammatically straight outline. You are a competitor. That is more unethical and lying. That's not right. This was firing from the hip. He's down here just. But he's got to lay it down. He's got to lay it down. I mean what this really could say is that even though you have an economic incentive to align with this person, you need to distance yourself from them because you know that they are in the wrong. Like that's like the fact that Venode has bags here and he's still posting this makes it more severe. Right? Like yeah, but I. But, but I think it's. I think there is a chance that Vanode kind of forgot that, you know, you think that exposure. I think you got to put that at like 15%. I just feel like. Yeah. Forgot. Is that possible? I don't know. I don't know what. I mean he's a multi billionaire. The economic. I mean he Was coming. He was coming. He came on the show last week. Last week. To talk about. He's clearly working more closely with another. Thank you, dad. Was it called fa? I like that. Sign up for that. But yeah, he's clearly like on the board of that company and not on the board of Factory. Because the really crazy thing is, like, how did this. Not. How did this go straight on the timeline? Like, this should have been a text message. And maybe it was, but you're only talking about two and a half hours. I feel like if a portfolio founder is out of control, you would text them and say, hey, you are in the wrong. You're about to get smoked. You don't have the leverage here. Like, you would say, hey, look, you're a second tier competitor and you're being unethical. Then you're lying. So I think you should take the post down and apologize. You know, you would say that behind closed doors. Yeah. You would text that. You would not just go straight to the truth nuke from outer space, which is what Vinod did. It's a truth. Well, Well, I don't. I don't even think it's necessarily. I wouldn't call it a truth nuke because it's. It's an ad hominem. Like, he just went directly, Adam. He didn't even talk about. Okay. Any of the facts. Well, so here's Luke Metro. If he knows the facts are true and it's cool. We don't. We don't disagree that it's a nuke. Correct. Definitely a nuke. It's definitely a nuke. The question is, is it a truth nuke or is it an ad hominem nuke? And I think it might be a truth because I think as an investor, you might actually know the truth of what happened. You might know because he could go into like the internal Khosla Slack or something and say, like, who are the board members? Is this guy actually a board member? You know, like. Like what, what files have been shared from Factory to our board? Oh, nothing relevant that would be useful to cognition. You know, he could have made that decision. What are you. What are you calling it, Tyler? Ad homine nuke. Ad hominu. Okay. It's an ad homineuk. We'll leave it there. I think we close that out. But Luke Metro said what I think everyone was thinking. Can we please not start cognition versus factory before we get a resolution to rippling versus deal? Great post. That being said, wildly different situation than rippling versus deal. When the rippling Deal drama broke. There was immediately insane, seemingly insane. Smoking guns that are getting worked out through the court system. But it was like a rippling. Had basically like tricked deal in some ways. Right. Wait, really? Oh, I don't remember that at all. I mean, it's. It's sort of fuzzy at this point. It was like a honeypot operation. Yeah, that is sort of a trick. That's sort of tricky. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Well, yeah, honey pot is a better way to. I think that was like their term. Right. They all this being said, the honey pot in this situation. My current, My current read is that CRO, you know, the advisor goes to Matan and says, I'm getting poached. And Matan says, you can't get poached. You're being fired for unethical conduct. But the firing happened days after he was notified that he was leaving for a competitor. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Keith said it is unethical per se, to even interview at a competitor while attending board meetings and board dinners. And I read this and I was like, yeah, I think that's right. I think I agree with that. But then I was thinking about, like, how would you do this? How would he have done this more responsibly if that's what happened? And I was like, so you have to resign because you think that you should go interview at a competitor and then reach out to them? And it doesn't seem like that's the way things happen that often. I don't know. People, like, even direct competitors will maintain somewhat jovial interactions. Oh, how's it going? Oh, it's going great. Yeah. Cool, man. And both parties are kind of just saying nothing thing, but you are having like a conversation technically because you like bump into someone at a conference, you might both be on stage at the same part talking about agentic AI or something. I don't know. And then, and then I was thinking about, like, how does this rank? If he was. If the. If the new cognition CRO, I forget his name was on the. Chris Degnan. If Chris Degnan was on the. He was a board observer or board advisor. What's the terminology? I think his only. From what I understand, his only technical title was Advisor Advisor. Okay, so I'm just thinking like back to your. Back to your original frame of like, is this more or less hardcore than before? And I'm thinking about like the Steve Jobs and Eric Schmidt interaction where like, Eric Schmidt is on the board of Apple and being like, we're buying Android over at Google. We're launching Android over at Google and Steve Jobs gets pissed. Yeah. But it doesn't spill out on the timeline or where Steve Jobs, another. Another comp is like Mike Krieger. Oh yeah. His involvement with Figma and resigned from the board, I think a couple days. A day before launching a competitor. Yeah. So again, this stuff has been happening. But the funny thing is to see this like whole. All this drama around companies that provide basically enterprise applications when, when you look at what's happening on the research side where aggressive, constant aggressive poaching around like truly, like companies developing truly novel IP that basically have no protections where you can work at a company for five years, learn a bunch about what they do, get poached and bring all of that know how over to a new company within the same 24 hour period. Right. And so I just don't. This whole situation, like an advisor that gets poached doesn't feel like a big deal at all to me in the context of everything else that's been happening. Yeah, yeah. It's just. And ultimately I don't think, I think the story is like over like I think it's. It. No, I think you're right. Yeah. It's different because the researchers do post, but they don't have as many interactions with VCs. So there's that back and forth about the three OpenAI researchers who are just fired according to the Wall Street Journal for sharing information. But that doesn't reach the level of board interaction. So you're not going to see board members, at least that I can tell, doing drama about it. And even when the talent wars happen between Meta and. And OpenAI, like we were the ones that were posting the most like spicy stuff about it. Right. Because like the board members, they don't necessarily have the same level of interaction with the researchers as the other board advisors. Yeah. And so I think this just gets a lot more personal, I think. Anyway, you want to close the book on this? Are you sure? Miles says, I want to call. Okay, we're going back into the trough. Let's go back. Let's go back. Let's go find the pigs. Let's do it. Miles says, I work with a company that's doing great by all definitions. Recently one of its star executives was poached by an A plus company to lead a very popular product. Founders tried to retain him. They couldn't, so they wished him well and began the recruitment process. Replace him. The investors sent him notes thanking him for all his work. No temper tantrums or ethics debate debates or Twitter name Dragging. Just grownups getting back to work. And Martin over at a 16C says, Boring. Yeah, but that's kind of what Miles is advocating for. He's like, these types of interactions should be boring. Right. So I don't know. That's reasonable. Sean McGuire says, nice one from the cheap seats, you know, 1% of the story. And Sean's really like teasing something. He's like, there's going to be the files, there's going to be some crazy drop. There's going to be another truth nuke. It's going to be truth World War 3, something like that. Yeah, but has he actually posted anything like, it feels like today is the day to like, share the, like the truth. I hope everyone can sort it out behind the scenes. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah. He said he has a nuclear weapon. Yeah, that's a truth nuke. He has a truth nuke. That's what he's saying. A nuclear weapon. On the timeline. But he did come out and say, cognition is Infosys masquerading as anthropic. And then, which is funny because Infosys does like technology IT transformation, which is in many ways what cognition does. So it's. But the only thing I would disagree with Sean on is I, I don't see cognition like masquerading as anthropic. No, not at all. You talk to Scott Wu and he's like, yeah, we're providing enterprise value, automating, code generation and business. Yeah, yeah, it's not an anthropic LARP at all over there. I mean, like, they, they, they take their business seriously. But that's not an anthropic. That's not uniquely anthropic. Well, and also, also this would tell me that the two, that factory and cognition are going in very different directions. Maybe thinks the Infosys direction is bad. Yeah. And hopefully they can go in different directions. That's great. And maybe they could even work together at some point. Okay. Yeah. And maybe you don't need the snowflake CRO if you have discovered some fundamental thing. Right. Like the whole tease was like, we did something on the research side, but like that doesn't matter if your CRO leaves. Right. Hopefully he didn't. Hopefully he doesn't even understand it. He doesn't even understand what's going on in the research department. He's like, I don't know, there's a bunch of mumbo jumbo. Just tell me who to call and sell it to. Yeah, I don't know. Anyway, let me tell you about Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform that grows with your business. Lets you sell in seconds online, in store, on mobile, on social, on marketplaces. And now with AI agents moving on.

Provider. Use your favorite agents to deploy web app servers, databases and more. Wild railway automatically take scale of scaling, monitoring and security. There are. There's some drama, Jordy. We got. We got to talk about the drama. But Pop Tarts has ended their Buzzballs partnership. This is huge. But on the other side of things, there's more collabs happening because Mr. Beast Feastables partnered with Liquid Death Peanut Butter Cup Soda flavored sparkling water. So. Okay, so we kind of. We kind of ended up like, net neutral. We're net neutral. Yes. Yes. It's reincarnated in some ways. Yeah. It never really died. It never really died. This has been reincarnated as the Mr. Feastables. Mr. Beast Feastables Liquid Death Peanut Butter Cup Soda flavored sparkling water. That is a long name for a product. Do you think this is going to fly off shelves? The Mr. Beast Feastables Liquid Death Peanut Butter Cup Soda flavored drinking water sparkling water. It looks like a nightmare. Peanut butter cup water is a crazy move, right? Yeah, but maybe that's untapped. But maybe we're living in a crazy world. Maybe the next coconut water. No one was drinking coconut water back when, you know, before. Before it came to America. I don't know. Maybe peanut butter cup water is the next thing. Tyler, this is. This has got you written all over it. Friday challenge. Drink a six pack of peanut butter cup water. Would you rather drink the mrbeast Feastables Liquid Death Peanut Butter Cup Soda flavored sparkling water or the Pop Tarts Buzzball Frosted S'? Mores? We love you. Leave us five stars on Apple podcast and Spotify. See you tomorrow.

Their business is securing it. CrowdStrike secures AI and stops breaches. We gotta talk about this house. We gotta do another tier list. There's a house that's for sale in Los Angeles that is accepting OpenAI equity and anthropic equity. And we need to do another tier list to decide whether or not it's a good house. Is it worth precious shares in frontier AI, or should the humble AI researchers sitting on 30 million of equity in a Frontier lab sit this one out? So we have the Zillow here. I will pull it up. And I want Jordi to give me some tier list stuff. So 1210 Chicory Lane in Los Angeles, price cut $4 million cheaper. A humble $30 million. 5 beds, 11 baths. Rate that ratio. Twice as many baths. Having twice as many baths as bedrooms. Where does that fit in the tier list? I think that's excellent. That's excellent. A tier. A tier. A tier. We got an A tier for having twice as many baths. My man likes extra bath. The only 1300 squares. A lot of bathrooms for a third of an acre. Okay, so third of an acre. 0.35. Technically just over a third of an acre. Where do you put the acreage? D tier. Rough. Well, that's just a personal thing. It is like, to me, like smaller house on more land. Okay. But there's gonna be some people that are fired up on the view and they don't care that they can't really touch the earth anywhere on the property. Okay, we got some other stuff in here. So it's set at the end of a quiet cul de sac. Where do you sit? Quiet cul de sacs. Are you a cul de sac guy? Feng shui. Not can be rough on the feng shui side for defense purposes. No, no, no. Like trapped energy. Okay, okay, okay. So I'm hearing D tier. F tier. F tier for the cul de sac. Okay. Cul de sac's F tier. Sorry. Sorry, folks. It's fine. Be honest, be honest. The view is really incredible. Okay, so the view is. The view is S tier. S tier. What about the 110 linear feet of 11 foot motorized glass walls that disappear completely, transforming the great room into an open air retreat above the city. I hate motorized glass walls. Okay, what are we doing in what tier are you putting it in? Motorized. 110ft of motorized glass experience. F tier. F tier. And I say this because I unfortunately have them. And you have to. You can only put this in F tier if you've been like late at night. You know you're gonna like turn off the lights and I accidentally hit the motorized door button. Yeah, yeah. Like literally middle of the night. Okay. Is it loud? At least mine. You have to wait until they get to the end. Like it's gas power so it needs to fire up a V6. It's not super loud, but it's incredibly annoying when you're sitting there and suddenly your entire house is open air past midnight. Okay. Lightning round formal dining room. A tier. A tier. Ocean facing library, office. S tier. S tier. Four stone islands. Is that too many maybe. Quite possibly. So we're putting it in C tier. Okay. Lower level brings together media lounge and illuminated bar. Do you like an illuminated bar? Not for me, but I think, I think. Give me a tier. Give me a tier. B tier, temperature controlled wine room. If you turn it into a data center, I think it's A tier. Okay. Cinematic theater. Like Toby Lakita cinematic theater. S tier. Because I could say John. Hey. Because I'll be over using it. Okay. Glass enclosed fitness studio. Do you like a home fitness studio? No, I don't like working out at home. So F tier. F tier. Working out in a great gym is just a million times better. Okay, we'll end with this one and I'm hoping for a good result. We're going with the 60 foot zero edge infinity pool and spa that appear to dissolve into the hills joined by multiple multiple lounge and fire areas. A full outdoor kitchen and a flat lawn. D tier. D tier. What? You said pools were S tier yesterday. The most elite setup for a pool is basically like grass surrounding the full pool. Okay. And being able to go from grass straight into the water is obviously F tier. And anytime it's just kind of like a body of grass to water is S tier. Out of the water and you're falling down the hill. That's F tier. Yeah. Okay. Okay. I think we clarified it. Well, agree or disagree with Jordy, make your call. As long as you got 30 million in cash. OpenAI stock or anthropic equity because the seller will accept equity as payment fast.

The most trusted rating agency for over 30 years. Egon Jones is blackpilling. Says it's over. Complete disruption of the economy is now all but certain, thanks to AI. It has a community note. Now. Joe Eisenthal shared this, so I don't think it's fake news. But the purported Egan Jones Risk Commentary number 22 does not appear on the firm's website. Okay, it might be entirely fake. They got him. Interesting. They got him. There's so much slop on the timeline, it's crazy. There was this fake. There was this fake New York Times article about a stock photographer that was put out of work. And I feel somewhat responsible for this because I was doing this bit like a year ago where I would take quotes from our friends and put them. Just inspect element. No AI. I would just go and edit the HTML to put a Jeremy Gaffon quote in the Financial Times and then screenshot it and share it to be like, oh, it's like, funny that one of their tweets is in the Financial Times. And then we got to the point where, like, we were actually commenting and we were actually in the Wall Street Journal with our, basically our tweets and our joke posts. And so things got very muddy there. And then people took the ability to instantiate these joke posts a little too far. So you can scroll the timeline and just see community note after community note of fake news. So people be safe out there. A lot of info hazards, but this one isn't. Let me tell you about CrowdStrike.

Moving on, what's next? Bunch of people got slop ads from Instinct. They're upset. I'm putting it because I think it's good. Get the Steelman helmet. But I would clarify. I don't think they're. I would be shocked if they're actually monetizing this already. Seems like it was just an experiment, right? Yes. Can we suggest products that people will want to buy? Because it would be a big. It would be a. I think everybody that the Noah's been very explicit that they plan to do this. Right. They plan to get deals with different retailers and platforms and be able to monetize the purchases that they draw. Yeah. Now, something I've always said, or at least said a lot in the last month or so, is that if you want to get to the point where you can have meaningful take rates, you need to be driving net new demand. Right. So if I go to my personal agent and say, buy me this thing, right. The demand was created elsewhere. It was generated with like advertisement or organic content or something caused me to want to go and buy it. And brands are not going to be standing up and lining up to pay big referral fees effectively when they already paid to create the demand elsewhere. And so this Instinct test is his. Hey, hey, we have a. We understand this person. Let's. Let's basically suggest some products that they maybe weren't thinking about but they would buy. And like a phone charger, like a power bank. Like a power bank or some sunscreen. I just like, I saw like 12 different screenshots that were all power banks. It's like, it is sort of universal. If you were going to, if you were going to blast, just blast that. I mean, yeah, I mean, we talked to Sean at the Ridge and he's like, yeah, they just move like it's a good business, but I don't know. So we gotta just figure out like, are they actually monetizing this? Because Instinct is in a position where you could literally just go and set up an Amazon referral fee thing and start taking a cut. And websites have done that for a long time. Like if you go to the Wirecutter, now owned by the New York Times, you will be able to click on checkout for a suitcase, for some sunglasses, for the best TV they have. And if you click on one of their partner sites, it puts a cookie there and when you check out, they actually do make a referral commission. I would be surprised if Instinct wasn't monetizing that. But at the same time, I think they might not even need to, because the scale of what they're trying to do is more just like, understand the consumer and then have the next proof point for the next race. Because obviously it's incredibly compute intensive. They're gonna be. They're growing very quickly. They're gonna be raising very quickly and being able to go back to the next round of EC's and say, hey, we've actually tested E Commerce and it converts at seven times the rate of Instagram reel ads or whatever. And it's like, we have this. This much surface area, and here's the response. And yes, there was a lot of feedback that was like, oh, this is slop. Who's that? It's shop Slop or whatever. Shopslop. Dave Morin call it from Open Claw. Yeah. Somewhat. Somewhat, Somewhat biased. Right. He's running the open. Like, he's running the foundation. Oh, sure, sure. Which, you know, is like, basically own your compute, own your agent. Yeah. Don't get ads pushed to you. Have your agent be aligned to you. That. That's. Yeah, yeah. That's their stance. I think that. Yeah. I think overall, here's. Here's the thing. Here's the thing, please. If they can actually give you a 10 out of 10 recommendation, people will love it. Right. Like, when you. When someone recommends you a product and you're just instantly like, yes, this is great. Yeah, that's a wonderful experience. The question is, how quickly, how quickly can they get there? It didn't really feel like they were nailing it, but we don't know. Like, maybe people are sharing screenshots. Like, one of these was pretty cool, was they found, like, some roe loafers, which are generally. They generally sell out. They're kind of hard to find. Yeah. And so it's possible this person didn't like it, but I think a lot of people would be like, cool. Thank you. You're like, this is. This is the worst thing ever. And then you see one thing, you're like. And you're like, okay. No, the one that I saw that I thought was funny was instinct knew that this guy had a 911 targa. And because they'd worked on some insurance stuff. Yeah. But the issue is that instinct was like, basically clock, like, okay, this guy's a car guy. I gotta hit him with a bunch of car stuff. Then it recommends a trickle charger, which 911s really don't need, especially modern 911s, and an indoor cover to use inside your garage. Which car guys I know would never use an Indoor cover because I said this yesterday briefly at the end of the show, but because if you have any sort of basically like the COVID against the paint can cause more damage than it just like sitting there. Right. So you generally want it out of the sun but you're better off just like leaving it. Especially because if there gets, if there can be any debris between the COVID and the paint, you get even more aware. But you can imagine how that knows about the user but it doesn't know about what car people actually want. Right. And so they can probably get better data recommend like a straight pipe exhaust system or under lighting or something that a car guy would want for their targa. Right? Yes, exactly. Spinners, as you always say, spinners or even just knobby off road tires, an off road kit, something like that. Yeah. With the shop slop screenshot here from Dave Morin, what sticks out to me is the fact that there's like five let's buy this buttons. I don't know, this seems like a normal E commerce site but the repetition there of all the calls to action is what's throwing me off and making this look sloppy. I don't know if that's what's triggering me, but the actual recommendations there of a couple things. Well, it's funny because this was always a historical concern with AI ads is the AI that you trust for information and to help you do things suddenly is like, come on, let's like I think we should buy this. Let's buy this. Yeah. What do you think? Should we buy this? Right, yeah. And it's like it ends up feeling a little. This feels a little bit pushy. Yeah. The other thing that stands out is they've taken a very UI light approach. Right. The Noah said you don't need new interfaces. It has a computer, it has a phone number. It has a number that you can text. But I feel like they're going to need to. They have to make interfaces. Right. And this is one of the first. And then yeah, again the challenge is like getting pushed products in text is just very, very, very, very person. It's just very, very personal. Yeah. Right. And I think that a lot of E commerce brands, you know, will use text marketing. I find that I'm like a thousand times more likely to unsubscribe from text marketing than I am to. From email marketing. Yeah, well, yeah, I mean it can be dangerous to operate on the previous era of like text message conversion rates and open rates because we have moved into a regime where my imessage at least probably Yours as well has a number of folders for unknown senders, promotions, spam transactions. And if it starts flagging Instinct or your AI agent, not as a friend, but as a promotions vehicle, it goes in that bucket and then the open rate goes way down. And this is what happened with like the newsletter Apocalypse and Gmail, where you got filtered off into a different section. You're not actually in the inbox anymore. And so that's pretty risky. I was demoing DOT yesterday and just had a phone call with it on the way home and was shopping and said like, go find this pair of pants that I bought in my Gmail. Go find another pair in like a slightly different color. And it was hunting around and it was just like, nothing's in stock in your size, bro. And I was like, is there some like global pants outage or something? Like, what's going on? And it was like, no, this isn't like a conspiracy or something. But I was actually like, kind of laughing back and forth. You're like, crazy. They're crazy. It was a pretty, it was a pretty delightful experience. But, but, but like, my end result was like, I was like, I don't want you just to send me random stuff, but I do actually want you to check on this. So go create a background task to check like every day for this pair of pants and then just let me know if they come back and stop. And it's like, I'm expecting one notification sometime in the next few months for that particular pair of pants and then I can just be like, get it. Okay. Yeah. But anyways, closing this segment out Instinct is as of, I think last week was like 13 or 14 people. Right. Like tiny. They're shipping super quickly. Yeah. As a, as a small team experimenting, I think that's important. Yep. And they just hired our friend Ben from cotu, who was at Snapchat for almost a decade leading like content and partnerships there. Yeah. He joined as a chief business officer at Instinct and I think that that is going to be a massive unlock for them. Yeah. There's so much that Ben can do. Yeah. I do think that there is a. To improve this experience. Make it more like an AMEX style experience. Yes. Right. Where it's very mass market and commercial. But they're trying to make it feel like elevated and put the, put the user first. They might need to do a new pre trained specifically on car guy data to really nail that. Really dial that in. No, I think that there is a little bit of a gap between the X Twitter community, the Tech people, the insiders who are like, I don't want a bunch of ads. And like, there's a lot of people who are like, yeah, like, I actually enjoy going through all the newsletters and sales in my email. I like the email. Email promotional marketing materials, and I watch the ads on Instagram. I like them. I enjoy having products be shown to me in a certain way. There's some people that, you know, maybe they park their car on a public street and then they go back to their car, maybe after going to a restaurant. And there's one of those, like, business card ads, like, I will buy your junk car. You ever get those? No. In LA there's people that, like, they'll put a business card, like, in your windows. Like, I've gotten that business card, but for like, like gardening or like, well, trim your trees like that. Yeah. I've never gotten an offer to buy my car. Yeah, I've got the multiple times in L. A. Like, we buy junk cars. I'm like, wow, shots fired. I thought I was. Thought I was doing all right. Yeah, it was kind of a. Kind of a nag. But, yeah, I think a lot of people will, Will. Will be excited to have, like, the daily text of, like, the best product that they could. That they could possibly buy. John says nobody on earth can do what better. Ben can change his instinct overnight. I agree. Sure. I've had a bunch of conversations with Ben about where consumer AI should go offline, and he's going to crush it. Okay. So let me tell you about Cisco.

Both sides are going so kind of against each other in crazy ways and thinking, well, if I spend more money so against you, I'm going to convince you that you're wrong and that you're going to say yes to my stuff. That's where we are right now. That's the exact wrong way. And we're talking with the hyperscalers, the collocators as well into say calm down. Get closer to the folks in your communities. The schools, the churches, the NGOs, the communities. They're good people. They like us. They Americans. They want to have a good life in front of them. Speak less loud. Try to listen. Come with Solutions. Technology is going to help all those things there. And for whatever reason we spent two weeks in China a week ago. Well, 90% love it. Yeah, well, that's exactly what the Chinese want us to slow down. You say, well, are we doing the right thing here? Well, maybe not. No, I completely agree.

Yes, a mark. A mark to market for enthusiasm. I would say pretty excited, let's see. So you know, sometimes I like to think back about like, okay, when was Falcon 9 at this level of maturity? And of course you can account for all the synergies that SpaceX and compounding interest of learnings that they've had since then, going to orbit and landing. You know, this one technically landed in the ocean but it was, you know, from a physics perspective essentially the same thing as like let's say Flight 21. So you're kind of in the 2015 timeframe if you will, in Falcon nine years if you want to mark to market that way from an enthusiasm factor. I mean, I don't know, you saw those videos, they were awesome. It's hard to not be enthusiastic about the space industry after you see a skyscraper spitting out data centers into orbit. That's pretty effing cool. Yeah.

That. So I'm definitely excited about AI's contribution to life sciences and the biotech industry at large. It's a force multiplier. It's also a great pairing with a company like Vardo, where the aspect that we're offering is a low gravity environment to create chemical outcomes that you otherwise wouldn't be able to do on Earth, period. So even if you know, even if you can, or if AI does unlock the answer, if you will, to do something, you still have to go to space to get to microgravity. You cannot fail, physically replicate microgravity or lower gravity on Earth. That's Einstein's principle of equivalence. And so I'm super excited about this, especially with respect to monoclonal antibodies and informing us which drugs make the most sense to crystallize in microgravity. So in the same way that this is acting as kind of a tide raises all boats in the biotech industry. That's also true for Varda, of course. And the lucky aspect for us is that that gravity knob is something we have a monopoly on right now. Yeah, monopoly on gravity. Let's give it up for that.